Talk:Anarchist communism

Libertarian Communism

This article has next to no information on libertarian commnism, yet people searching for it are redirected here.

The sign for Anarcho-Communism

Usually isn't it a flag that's half diagonally with red either on top or bottom and black the opposite of where the red is? --User:Paracite 9:41, january 9, 2006

Is there a sign for Anarcho-Communism?

Is there? Maybe we could make one.. That would be cool. Perhaps.. an A with a C... hmm. Maybe 120? But that wouldn't be too fair to the europeans.. Maybe 120-240AC based on Alternating currents from different countries. With the A being the anarchy symbol... ooh, what a neat idea. --Cyberman 01:32, September 8, 2005 (UTC)

There is one on the french version of this article (see http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-communisme). --CyberKeupon 11:50, january 2, 2006

Can anyone verify the validity of that logo? --Evil Eccentric 04:32, 11 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Stuff

Anarcho-Communism should be redirected to this page as oppossed to Libertarian Socialism. Anarcho-Communism is only a strand of Libertarian Socialism, but is a synonym of Libertarian Communism. TPermyakoff

As it stands, the article is very shallow and uninformative. It should be improved by someone with knowledge in the field, or merged with libertarian socialism. I don't know enough about anarcho-communism to be able to add anything to the article myself. -- Mihnea Tudoreanu 10:18, 2 Oct 2004 (UTC)

"Anarcho-Communism is a particular branch of libertarian socialism": please elaborate in the article. A-giau 10:57, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I suggest that we add that anarcho-communism is basically communism without the transitionary period (AKA socialism). We could add the basic ideas of anarcho-communism (no private property, communually owned means of production, etc.), information about anarcho-communism and human nature, famous examples of anarcho-communism, and famous anarcho-communists. --Jazz Remington 06:00, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

announcing a policy proposal of general interest

This is just to inform people that I want Wikipedia to accept a general policy that BC and AD represent a Christian Point of View and should be used only when they are appropriate, that is, in the context of expressing or providing an account of a Christian point of view. In other contexts, I argue that they violate our NPOV policy and we should use BCE and CE instead. See Wikipedia:Neutral point of view/BCE-CE Debate for the detailed proposal. Slrubenstein | Talk 22:55, 15 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Move?

I general hear this called "Anarchist communism" and that phrase does in fact edge "Anarcho-communism" out in Google search results. Admittedly it's true I have a personal preference for the former term (which eliminates the seemingly patriarchal anarcho), and would like some support on the matter before engaging in a move. Sarge Baldy June 28, 2005 03:33 (UTC)

Yes.. I have wondered that myself... Anarcho-communism is perhaps an Americanism ... Anarchist-communist I seem to remember was used by Nestor Makhno and the Organizational Platform of the Libertarian Communists/platformists.. but the terms are pretty much interchangable no?. -max rspct 28 June 2005 14:07 (UTC)

It might be, although I know even some groups in the US use "anarchist communism". I'll give people another day or so, and if there's no objections I'll move it. Sarge Baldy June 29, 2005 22:27 (UTC)

Why has someone changed "anarchist communism" to "anarchocommunism" throughout? The article is correctly entitled "anarchist communism". "Anarchocommunism" isn't used by anybody (some people refer to anarchist communism as "anarcho-communism," a usage derivative of "anarcho-syndicalism" which post dates the development of anarchist communism). Robgraham 19:23, 1 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Communist template

Is the communist template really appropriate for this article? The origins of anarcho-communism happened alongside what is considered communism for that template, rather than growing out of it, and had more to do with Proudhon than Marx. In addition, most anarcho-communists are openly hostile to state communism, rather than friendly to it. Kev 8 July 2005 08:45 (UTC)

"State communism" is oxymoronic. Anarcho-communists consider themselves communist, and Marxists != Communists. Yes, it doesn't have anything to do with Marx in fact, but is still derived from the communist movement. -- Natalinasmpf 8 July 2005 13:54 (UTC)

Be that as it may, and I would tend to agree, the current template lists all the following amongst "schools of communism": Marxism · Leninism Trotskyism · Maoism Left Communism Eurocommunism. To my knowledge not a single one of these "schools" is generally considered compatible with anarcho-communism according to anarcho-communists. So while I do understand that anarcho-communism is listed under "related-subjects", because it is a related subject, I don't understand why the anarcho-communism article should dedicate space to two separate templates, one of which is more obviously relevant, and the other which is host to a bunch of movements hostile to anarcho-communism. Kev 8 July 2005 14:04 (UTC)

I'm going to go ahead and remove the template pending a response here. Kev 05:21, 13 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Sigh*, reflects something awful I suppose, that the original meaning of communism - anarcho-communism, in terms of minmalised state control and communal living has been lost to the Marxist kind. I do wish to emphasise though that anarcho-communism vehemently considers itself a communist movement (I think), or perhaps I do, because "communist", discounting the social stigma is a rather good word to use in place of "anarchism", which tells of no state, which really isn't descriptive (doesn't distinguish from anomie) - and well...having the "communist template" makes one remind that this is a libertarian socialist movement...emphasis on socialism (which communism is a branch of), emphasis on libertarianism (which anarchism is a branch of) - in my personal opinion, both templates are justified, because both philosophies (which are compatible - liberty and collectivism/socialism) are both vital and fiercely part of anarcho-communism. But it does reflect how foul our Marxist comrades have been. It's like watching your brother or sister become corrupted by drugs until you can't recognise him or her anymore. -- Natalinasmpf 05:52, 17 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I very much understand where you are coming from. Contrary to most public opinion, I know that all forms of communism do not stem from, nor are they all dependent on, Marxism. I agree with you above that Anarcho-communists are, imho, the only actual form of communist, and that Leninists, Maoists, etc, are little more than capitalists who invest at the state level today with a supposed "vision" of become communists someday. I believe that the best thing to do would be to try to reclaim the word, so that at the very least it does not necessarily entail Marxism. However, atm the article on communism begins with the following sentences, "Modern communism is associated with The Communist Manifesto of Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels..." and "Communism is now mainly understood to refer to the political, economic, and social theory of Marxist thinkers, or life in conditions of Communist party rule." These statements are a sad reflection of our historical understanding in modern times, but it is also probably true.

I think this situation is very similar to the libertarian page. A word once synonymous with anarchism has now been so far removed from it by the capitalists that the template now only lists movements which advocate capitalism, and the article deals exclusively with the capitalist form of libertarianism and their perspective on the issue. It is an unfortunate distortion of the words anarchists have used to describe their ideals, made all the more frustrating because those very ideals are being used in a crass and opportunistic manenr as a mask to cover true oppression of a kind anarchists have always decried.

However, much as I would like to reclaim both words, I would rather see anarchism distanced from both than to see people begin to either equate anarcho-communism with state socialism (as many do now on the libertarian capitalist side of things), or to see people equate anarchism in general with lassez faire capitalism (which is a small but frightening trend). And the sad matter at hand now is that some of the very people who have violently suppressed anarcho-communists and other anarchists in the past are now the ones most closely associated with communism on wikipedia. Kev 08:37, 17 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

anarcho-communism section in Anarchism

They need some help over there. Apparently some people think that anarcho-communists supports the products of labor as private property rather than collective property. RJII 05:05, 13 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Nobody has made any edits stating that anarcho-communists support the product of their labor as private property. Nor has anyone claimed that anarcho-communists believe that they support any form of private property. The only claims that have been maintained that are relevant to the page is that anarcho-communists sometimes uphold personal possessions as legitimate. The fact that Tucker or Proudhon would have called that private property is not really relevant. Kev 05:20, 13 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You're the one that deleted the statement that they oppose private property! And, deleted the statement that the believe that the produce of labor should not be private property! Try a little honesty sometime will you? RJII 14:09, 13 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I worked the statement concerning their views on private property into the text in a different way because another editor objected to the way your phrased it. As to the produce of labor being private property, that isn't what your edit said, Mr. Honest. Kev 14:39, 13 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

kev deleting important and useful info

Kev, why are you deleting some information I put in explaining anarcho-communism? I put in a quote from Cafeiro who was involved with the First International that explains his reasoning for opposing private ownership of the produce of labor. And I put in a quote from Dejaque criticizing Proudhon. Anarcho-communism developed as an explicit rejection of Proudhonism because it support private ownership of produce of labor and exchange markets. RJII 16:38, 30 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This Article Needs More Attention

Anarcho-communism is a popular leftist movement which includes aspects of libertarian socialism. Simply clarifying what separates anarcho-communism from libertarian socialism would be a step in the right direction.

ahh!!!!;lkjs;fklsaldfj anarcho-capitalism seems to be a self defeating phrase; let me get this straight- basically, there is no law, but a bunch of people get together willingly and agree on a sort of contract if you will, and this contract says "if you don't pitch in, we'll boot you out" and yet there is no legislation, enforcement of rules/laws (can laws exist in an anarchist state, even on a personal communal level?). But in an anarchic state, natural laws exist, right? so to survive the adversity of others using their freedom to compete with you and your anarchic commune, you must work and compete as a commune to survive. So its kinda like collective darwinism, perhaps?

Introduction needs a rewrite

The introduction blurb needs to be rewritten it seems. The first paragraph does not give a good definition or description of Anarchist-Communism, but rather immediately delves into what it is similar to and what it should not be confused with. I'm not an expert on the topic, but the first thing that struck me about the article is its lack of a clear definition at the very beginning.

I think all of the information below the first paragraph should be in a section called 'Development and Theory' or something, to neaten up the introduction and the whole article. PJB 19:49, 19 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Done it PJB 19:52, 19 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Can someone in the know come up with a definitive and concise introductory paragraph? I don't really know anything about this subject, and have only a rudimentary knowledge of anarchism, but found the lead section pretty alienating and wordy, without reaching any kind of definition.

The paragraph mentions the word 'communist' or 'communism' fourteen times, 'anarchism', 'anarchy' or 'anarcho' seven times, 'libertarian' nine times, and 'socialism' three times. This is far too much, bombarding the reader with terms they may not necessarily be familiar with. More importantly though, the lead section only explains what it Anarchist communism is not, rather than what it is. A good strong lead section is vital to keep a reader interested in the rest of the article - see WP:LEAD for more details. Can anyone help out here? Nuge | ^talk 15:17, 2 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Layout

Anyone else think the two templates for Anarchy and Communism should be one above the other? The introduction text would look very cramped on a smaller screen otherwise.

EvocativeIntrigue 14:56, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

RadicalMallard blanking out large portions and deleting Criticism section and links [1] [2]

RadicalMallard, why are you deleting the Criticism section? Those are real criticisms from individualist anarchists. I don't understand your comments about Bryan Caplan and anarcho-capitalism. The individualist anarchists cited are not anarcho-capitalists. And, what does Bryan Caplan have to do with anything? And, why are you deleting the external links that are critical of anarcho-communism? Aren't you aware of the NPOV policy? ALso, how do you explain this large scale blanking of material: [3] RJII 04:15, 17 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Criticism

I think there should be a quote here stating why Communist-Anarchism is undesirable or even incompatible with anarchism, as Victor Yarros' doesn't provide anything in the way of that information. Kapil 23:30, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Social Darwinism?

I was hoping someone with more knowledge on the subject could elaborate more on the anarcho-communist position on aiding the poor, elderly, disabled, et cetera, and just social programs of that nature in general. How would education be handled (typically) in this type of society? Hospitals? How would these kinds of things be regulated? --Animarxivist 15:24, 5 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Religion

Is anarcho-communism against religion like other forms of communism or does it just let you do your own thing?