Talk:Bonanza

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WIDOWED BEN CARTWRIGHT. Why on earth would someone insert the words "whose wives are no longer living" when the previous sentence describes the patriarch as the "thrice widowed Ben Cartwright". It is rather difficult to be widowed with surviving wives (not to mention being a bigamist). There should be some sort of IQ test to prevent such moronic contributions!!!- SL

one can have more than one wife, serially, some of whom are dead, some living. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.110.223 (talk) 21:36, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, one CAN have HAD more than one wife serially. One is considered a widower if the last wife is dead. But thrice widowed is thrice widowed- no divorce!? RC

Adam Lost

Of all western heroes, Adam Cartwright is the most unsual. He was the renaissance cowboy and openned the show to a wide depth of stories. The show lost depth without him. Any successful remake would have to center upon him to keep its theme relevant and interesting in a timeless fashion. In his absence the show became overly dependant upon Landon's character and suffered from his myopic outlook in contrast to its more imaginative past.

Oh puhlease

The show was successful for *years* after Roberts left. I guess it was the "Adam Cartwright Show". I personally didnt miss him a whole lot. Anyway, I have edited the article to make it less about how glorious the show was with Roberts--and more factual.

The Bonanza Syndrome is the term for how love interests, old friends, lost family members, etc of the Cartwrights would regularly end up dead, often as part of the episode in which they first appear. It should be identified by name. It is not a "running gag" as it was not intended to be a joke or humorous within the context of the show. In fact it is more of a dramatic device to raise tension and write out a character so they don't have to appear in further episodes. It is only a running gag in the context of televised drama fandom.

I agree that it wasn't a "running gag" within the context of the series, even though it might have been outside of it. Please see NPOV? below. Wakedream (talk) 17:56, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Someone a little too broken hearted about Roberts departure?

I find the tone of this article to be a little less than neutral. Obviously the author has not done their homework, because Bonanza did not reach the #1 rating spot until Season 6, Pernell Roberts last year on the show, and remained #1 for the next two years. It remained in the top ten from seasons three to twelve, despite cast changes. Also the wording on the cast-changes clearly favors Pernell Roberts ("half-hearted attempts at cast changes")

Answer- Not really. Neither of the two attempts (Clay/ Will) were given enough time to develope. Not because of viewer dislike, but because the remaining cast saw that writing-in new family members, if allowed to continue, could be used as a threat in their own contract negotiations. And they cut it off in the bud. This was not an assault on Barry Coe or Guy Williams, it was self preservation. -Collins Richman

Greyias 13:17, 4 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No criticism

this entry does not seem to portray any criticism of the show. For example, did it contribute to the negative stereotype of native americans, or anything.

The only thing I can think of that negatively stereotyped anyone would be Asian-Americans (the Hop Sing role was very stereotypical), but then again that's my view and I don't have sources saying other people think so. Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 20:01, 5 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

i haven't watched the show in years but i don't remember any negative depictions of native americans. quite the contrary

Mined

"Virginia City ... was mined for 19 years": ?

Fair use rationale for Image:Bonanzalogo.jpg

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UK broadcasts

I'm sure I used to watch Bonanza on BBC TV in the 1980s, but I can't remember any more details. It ran for what seemed like (and probably was) years and years there. 86.132.138.205 02:55, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Trivia & Pop Culture References

I would like to understand why this information about the show has been removed? Granted, a number of the references were obscure ones, however it's important to understand the impact this show (or any other TV program for that matter) has had on other aspects of TV, movies, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.38.133.106 (talk) 15:08, 2 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

umm it's called trivia precisely because it's not important. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.110.223 (talk) 21:41, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I can't say I know why it was removed, but trivia sections, while not forbidden, are discouraged on Wikipedia. If you believe information that appeared in that section benefits the article, you could add it back by incorporating it into the main article. Hope this helps! Wakedream (talk) 17:50, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

türkiye

turkıyedene zaman yayınlandı acaba ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.169.193.30 (talk) 11:36, 23 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Full Season DVDs

My mother is a fan of this series, and during holiday we discovered that in Germany, they somehow managed to publish entire Season Boxes (up til Season 6 at the moment) [1]. I'm not sure how exactly this works rights-wise. But if someone can track this down and write something about it, it could help a lot of fans, I guess. -- Harry 16:29, 1 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

NPOV?

There are several things in this article that I believe are in violation of WP:NPOV. I've listed these in bold italics below. Note that I personally agree with most of these, but that's my opinion and doesn't make it acceptable for a Wikipedia article. Some of these I believe could stay if they were sourced--it may not be a fact that Hoss was "warm and lovable," but it may be a fact that some survey showed a majority of surveyed viewers agreed with that, or that a studio release or prominent reviewer described him that way. An opinion is not a fact, but it is a fact that so-and-so held that opinion.

All of the regular cast members had appeared in numerous stage, television and film productions before Bonanza, but none was particularly well-known.
...Cartwright family, headed by wise, widowed patriarch Ben Cartwright
...the second was the warm and lovable giant Eric, better known by his nickname: "Hoss"
...the youngest was the hotheaded and impetuous Joseph or "Little Joe"
A running gag (which also occurs in the TV western The Big Valley), was that every time one of the Cartwrights became seriously involved with a woman, she died from a malady, was slain, or left with someone else. As with all hit programs, disturbing a successful formula could be a major blunder.
...he'd read the list of casualties on the radio every week in his deep, resonant voice
Hoss had a tender heart and a penchant for lost causes.
But, as might be expected, it was young Michael Landon who received the most fan mail.
Some of the shows Landon directed are considered to be the most moving and socially relevant of the series
..."Candy" Canaday, a confident army-brat turned cowboy
Several episodes were built around his character, one Matheson never had a chance to fully develop before the show's sudden demise
Many felt the Hoss character was essential, as he was a nurturing, empathetic soul who rounded-out the all-male cast
Greene wore his modest frontal piece in private life too
...have been immensely popular on cable networks
Michael Landon became an industry "mover"
Victor Sen Yung died a mysterious death in his home in 1980.
The blonde Michael Landon, Jr., who bears little resemblance to his father
...Dirk Blocker, who greatly resembles his father
A sign of the times was evident as Hoss' son Josh was born out of wedlock, something that could have been problematic in the original series ("The Big Valley", however, had a major character in Heath, who was presented as illegitimate. The "Gunsmoke" movies of the early 1990s employed a similar theme with Matt Dillon having sired an illegitimate daughter to Michael Learned).
...some believe gave the series a softer edge (talking about the series Ponderosa)
Bonanza also featured a memorable theme song
The Bonanza theme is one of the best known pieces of made-for-television music

Wakedream (talk) 17:35, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

ANSWERS:

Hmmm?. On some of these I would agree and on others I would disagree. It is true that referencing sources is essential. But after nearly fifty years since its creation, some pedestrian info can be accepted. The Candy character was indeed an army brat turned cowboy. His father's army credentials were mentioned a few times, including the first episode featuring Canary's Candy character. One should track-down the episode title and use it here. Candy was also, as part of his character discription, self-assured (confident).

Victor Sen Young's death was presented to the public as mysterious. The manner in which he died sparked speculation of suiside. Even Lorne Greene, in a 1981 syndicated Larry King radio interview, could not clarify the issue saying that the cause of his death was initially reported as "undetermined" though he felt it was accidental.

Saying that Hoss had a tender heart and a penchant for lost causes were words right out of the Ben Cartwright character's mouth. You wouldn't call Pa a liar now- would ya? The fact that many Hoss scripts depicted him as empathetic and nurturing can not be denied. Anthropologists have not really associated those as typically 1865 circa male traits. Did Hoss provide some balance to the all male cast by infusing plots with a compassionate perspective (ie female) storylines? Writer Virgil Vogel felt that Hoss presented a more subtle, caring approach that would have been otherwise absent. His opinion, yes. Is he correct??? Well, not many cowboys worry about skinning rabbits, reforming drunks, matchmaking, or disappointing children. Hoss did. (While journalist strive to be gender-neutral the real world is not adrogynous. Rather than a homogonenization of genders, why not appreciate their inherent differences and qualities equally?).

Was the orginal Evans-Livingston Bonanza theme memorable.? Well, if you were born in 1980- no. However, most "boomers" whether they were fans or not, would say yes. Thirty five years of repeats, and ongoing parodies have pretty much solidified it's rank as recognizable.

Regarding Lorne Greene's "modest" toupe. By all accounts, staff from several of his shows, it was just that- a smaller frontal piece, not a full crown toupe. This is not opinion but fact, though the sources are absent. Michael Landon himself briefly touched on this in an interview about his teen identification with Samson, which caused him to grow his hair longer. He also stated that he was the only orginal cast member "who kept my original hair"..

"A sign of the times was evident" regarding Hoss' illegitimate son Josh would be better rewritten as, "Societal changes were considered". Let's face it, even divorce was considered a TV taboo in the mid 1960s. In reality, Thomas Jefferson and Ben Franklin were said to have sired out-of-wedlock offspring. Jefferson and Franklin, however, weren't judged by Neilson ratings and network censors. Such births are not new, only the hushed treatment of the topic has changed.

Regarding Ms Sullivan's work on "Ponderosa" being the root of the PAX spin-off's "softer edge". The actor who played young Adam on "Ponderosa", Matthew Carmody, was vocal about the series nixing gunplay, which he felt emasculated the show. Interviews of the spin-off cast can be seen in "Bonanza Gold", a publication which also includes interviews with David Dortorts's daughter and past staff members involved with both series. (Personally, I liked the spin-off and thought it had high production values. Nonetheless, I like a little physical conflict as well). The remarks about Michael Landon Jr not looking like his dad are not jounalistically sound nor are they relevent. It is used to juxtapose Dirk Blocker's resemblence to his dad. While there may be some truth here, it is trivial. - Wes Angus —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.40.172.8 (talk) 13:37, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Bonanza theme lyrics

An anonymous editor added information to the Johnny Western article saying that Western wrote the lyrics to the theme from Bonanza. I've watched the show many times, and never heard any lyrics. However, I did recently see a reference that Bonanza star Lorne Green had released a version of the theme that did have lyrics. Does anyone have a source saying these were written by Johnny Western? Wakedream (talk) 19:06, 9 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Answer- There were two different lyric versions of the first and original Bonanza theme. One set of lyrics were written by Evans-Livingston. I am usure of the 2nd set. The Evans-Livingston words were in the pilot episode I believe, and deemed to be inappropriately placed in the storyline (as the four Cartwrights were mounting-up at the close of the show). Singer Michael Feinstein sang the Lyrics with the team on his Evans-Livingston CD in 2002, shortly before the duo died. The second music theme has no words, was used from 1970-1972, and written by scorer David Rose. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.40.172.8 (talk) 14:35, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Where is Dan Blocker?

Someone must have made a big mistake in the section that deals with the actors lives after Bonanza - Dan Blocker is not mentioned along with the other actors; instead there's information regarding some David Canary. In which way would he be involved in the Bonanza series? Would someone please correct this ASAP. Thanks! --83.250.69.113 (talk) 00:05, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Answer-Actor Dan Blocker died in May 1972 during the run of "Bonanza" (as stated in the text). He obviously had no subsequent acting jobs. Actor David Canary played the ranch foreman Candy Canaday for 5 1/2 years with Blocker and after his death (1967-70; 1972-73). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.40.172.8 (talk) 14:11, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Fix Gibberish

Can someone decode this sentence and fix it so that it makes sense?:

"He left the series in 1965 after long complaining he wouldn't work out father-submitting, violent context and racism, traits of the pattern originally conceived by David Dortort." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.238.3.10 (talk) 19:09, 19 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Answer- No, it makes zero sense and is mangled artiface. Roberts had several objections. He did object to using the word "Pa", as his character was to be somewhat sophisticated. He wasn't opposed to "father submitting"??? Roberts did work toward better hiring policies for minorites. The idea that Mr. Dortort is or was a racist has absolutely no merit. Was it common practice to hire whites to play minorities? Yes. Was the vocal liberal Marlo Thomas, who is Italian/ Lebonese, hired to played an Asian in one episode? Yes. Would you call Ms Thomas a racist? What about Yul Brenner, Bill Dana or David Carridine? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.40.172.8 (talk) 14:25, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]