Talk:Space music

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Audio Streams

Please post any other Audio Stream links for SpaceMusic specific stations. [ 157.130.35.50 17:57, 14 September 2005 (UTC) [1] ]

Not Ambient?

If space music isn't ambient music, why is Brian Eno listed as a key artist? [ 206.124.150.239 05:52, 30 May 2006 (UTC) [2] ]

Brian Eno is a crossover artist. Eno first appeared in HOS #004 (public radio network, 1983). Eno is credited with coining the phrase "Ambient music", (Brian Eno:Solo work) with his 1978 album "Ambient #1 / Music for Airports", but he had become well known in the USA long after MFTHOS (Music From The Hearts of Space) debuted on KPFA, Berkeley in 1973. Unknown is whether Eno, an Englishman, ever heard a tape of the original San Francisco Bay Area MFTHOS. ≈ Stephen Hill does use the word ambient twice in his web page's opening descriptive paragraph.[3] HOS show music is also described as contemplative, and therefore by definition is never irritating. Yet among other examples, Ambient music broadly includes irritating industrial machine noises (Metal Machine Music, Lou Reed, 1975, 1998, 2000) that would probably never be heard on HOS (or anywhere else in its entirety). ≈ Furthermore, Space music is not a subgenre of Ambient because, for just one example, traditionally rooted music such as whistle Celtic is regularly played on HOS. Whistle Celtic is also played on public radio's Thistle and Shamrock, a show apparently not claimed to be Ambient. ≈ Space music is therefore a fusion music, where fusion is understood as a blending process, not a genre or style (see Jazz fusion). Milo 04:27, 17 June 2006 (UTC) Re-edited 04:27, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Brian Ferry and Andy MacKay co-founded Roxy Music; eventually MacKay invited Brian Eno to join them; that happened in early , not late, 1970s. [ Brian W 10:51, 16 June 2006 (UTC) continues below ].

I recall pondering whether to include that line... Since you have stated the Roxy facts, I'll cut that reference from my edited answer comment above. My reporting error of late vs. early 1970's aside, who cofounded Roxy is elsewhere (mis)reported as including Eno (see Wikipedia Brian Eno:Roxy Music), history page for this date --> Milo 04:27, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Furthermore, I invite you to read Kosmische Musik, familiarize yourself with the history of German electronic music and finally realize that Popol Vuh released Affenstunde in 1970; if you listen to it you can agree that it may be regarded as the first cosmic, ambient and spacey album. Brian W 10:51, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

I had added Popul Vuh to the Notable artists list on 2006-05-15. They were on a list of artists who were featured on my favorite HOS shows, artists who's popularity I verified with the HOS playlist server. ≈ I've previously skimmed Kosmische Musik, and I'll put a heavy read of it on my to-do list. Milo 04:27, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Internal Server Error?

Anyone care to shed some light onto why two of the audio streams have this written beside them? Both webpages seem to work fine, so if there's no real reason for this, it should be removed. DezSP 01:29, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Do both streams play music for you? Milo 00:49, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Unpleasant sounds

Zeit, by Tangerine Dream makes use of unpleasent sounds. So do several other releases. Therefore, the unpleasent discordant sounds are as important. [ 71.135.12.149 14:37, 23 Oct 2006 (UTC) [4] ]

The HOS server lists 21 hits for Tangerine Dream, but, it does not hit on Zeit. That absence is a good example of meta composition, in which a composer only selectively defines the genre within limits set by the segue producer.

For radio, unpleasant sounds can't be "as important" (an equality), since half of the showcased pieces would sound unpleasant. Neither Hearts of Space nor Echoes typically sound like that, since they feature an uplifting type of show music for which the public is historically willing to pay money.

HOS often produces one late October show per year that is seasonally and musically "dark", spooky, edgy, intense, or disturbing in ways that evoke the supernatural. These shows are not always dissonant or necessarily unpleasant. Dead Can Dance (38 HOS playlist hits) group-soloed with their own show (#339 Dead Can Dance 12-Nov-1993), but later they and DCD's soloist Lisa Gerrard (68 hits), prominently featured in October (e.g., #471 'Gathering Gloom" 31-Oct-1997, Halloween). Not everyone likes DCD/Gerrard's artistry, but I wouldn't call it unpleasant.

By HOS numbers of 119 playlist hits, Vangelis is a more important example of highly selective meta composition. Vangelis has composed albums or parts of them that are unpleasant, not at all spacey, or (according to a space fan correspondent) just boring. Yet Stephen Hill obviously considers Vangelis to be an important HOS contributor — if his segue pieces are carefully selected. An analogy is adding a small proportion of a bitter cooking spice, which provides contrast to an otherwise cloyingly sweet recipe. Milo 07:13, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

Really Now

"multidimensional gradients"

What's this all about now? Hey hey? Gradients? Let's be honest with ourselves. Now. Yes. Ascensionedits 11:45, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

From the article: "Space music is subtly distinguished on multidimensional gradients, shading toward adjacent genres of new age, ambient, and electronic."

A spatial color image gradient is easy to visualize: "A transition between one color and another, or one shade of a color and another, or one density of a color and another. [5] The many users of graphics programs like PhotoShop are familiar with color and shade gradients. However, sonic gradients transition with audible time rather than visible distance. Glissando is a gradient of pitch with time.

A dimension can mean any characteristic that has a range of variation between two extremes. "Multidimensional" in this context means that multiple sonic characteristics are each transitioning on a gradient, and sometimes these gradients transition simultaneously with time. For example, the pitch of a note may slide from high to low frequency, while its timbre changes from a flute-like pure tone to a sax-like buzz tone. The gradient of timbre is space music genre's signature synth sound, which a space fan correspondent calls "zwhooshy" (a buzzy whoosh).

The multidimensional gradients[6] mentioned in the sentence specifically refer to a range of compositions that suggest a perceptually gradual transition between genres similar to space music.

I think "[[image gradient|gradient]]" should be wikified, but how much more of this explanation really needs to be put in the article? Milo 21:53, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

So there you have it, Ascensionedits. The meaning of "multidimensional gradients". To be honest, I thought the given answer was obvious. In fact, I think you knew it all along, and you're just having us on, to try and trap us in a cunning, erm, trap. My favourite bit was ""Multidimensional" in this context means that multiple sonic characteristics are each transitioning on a gradient, and sometimes these gradients transition simultaneously with time".
I was tied to my seat. If I wasn't, I'd have jumped out the window.
Gardener of Geda 22:37, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Lisa Gerrad and Mike Oldfield - space music?

Can anyone provide specific album names of the two artists that have the characteristics of space music? - User:Stardancer

Lisa Gerrard? I think they're taking the p1ss on that one. Great Music, but it's about as "spacey" as Britney Spears. And apart from his 1994 album, The Songs of Distant Earth, I wouldn't say Oldfield was "spacey" either.
Gardener of Geda 22:29, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Well I suggest that both Lisa and Mike are removed from the list of "notable artists". --Stardancer 09:17, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Do it, then!
Gardener of Geda 12:32, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Done.--Stardancer 12:55, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to put Lisa back in. She's been featured many times (with and without Dead Can Dance) on Hearts of Space [7]. I would suggest The Mirror Pool as typical of Gerrard space music.

As far as Oldfield, he is a key figure in progressive instrumental rock, which Stephen Hill definitely cites as one of the elements contributing to space music (e.g. Pink Floyd and Tangerine Dream). He has only had Oldfield a few times on the show, however, [8], so I'm not sure about putting him back in.

Except for one thing. Hill defines space music as music which evokes or creates a sense of mental "space" or place -- mental videos, or what we used to call eyelid movies. Much of Oldfield's music, particularly Hergest Ridge, Ommadawn and QE2, powerfully evokes this sense for many listeners. So I'm going to put him back in and cite those albums. --Bluejay Young 17:18, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

I still think that saying Oldfield's music is "spacey" is stretching the concept to a ridiculous length, particularly if you say it's because it "evokes or creates a sense of mental "space" or place". You could justify any album or artist in that case, no matter how inappropriate or daft. Or no matter who plays it on what radio station.

And QE2??!! Nooooooooo!!!! I like it fine, but "space"??!! With covers of Abba and Shadows tunes? Noooooooo!!!!!!

Still; whatever turns you on, I suppose. The article is hilarious with, or without Oldfield's presence. It don't mean a thang.

Gardener of Geda 18:31, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Help

Can someone patrol this article please? It has been a good article for months, but the user Gene Poole seems to want to destroy its sense and quality as he did with the Ambient music article thanks to his "rave subculture" - influenced point of view. I do not want to start an edit war. Thx.Dr. Who 01:21, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

I think you're over-reacting. Having read Gene's input to the Ambient article I see no evidence of any "rave subculture" - influenced point of view, or any "destruction" of any kind. There are parts of this article that are clearly ridiculous, and could use some editing. So please don't make subtle threats about possible "edit wars". It's not nice. You obviously don't like Gene - that's your problem. Has it anything to do with the fact that he's David Brent's double?

Gardener of Geda | Message Me.... 01:52, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

I do not know Gene Poole and his face, I am not British, therefore I do not know that rent you mention. What is the overeaction you mention? I should overreact becosue an imaginary person has posted a message right 30 seconds after I wrote at Talk:Ambient music? He hasn't written there for months. Someone cares very much for the post-Eno/neo rave definition of ambient (Jah Wabble, Bill Laswell, The Orb, and so on). I cant help more, sorry, I'm too busy with real world.Dr. Who 02:04, 1 February 2007 (UTC)