User talk:ChrisO~enwiki and Ars Technica: Difference between pages

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m It still does cater to PC enthusiasts
 
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{{Infobox Website
''Old discussions now at [[/Archive 1]] / [[/Archive 2]] / [[/Archive 3]] / [[/Archive 4]] / [[/Archive 5]] / [[/Archive 6]] / [[/Archive 7]] / [[/Archive 8]] / [[/Archive 9]] / [[/Archive 10]] / [[/Archive 11]] / [[/Archive 12]] / [[/Archive 13]] / [[/Archive 14]] / [[/Archive 15]] / [[/Archive 16]] / [[/Archive 17]] / [[/Archive 18]] / [[/Archive 19]] / [[/Archive 20]] / [[/Archive 21]] / [[/Archive 22]]''
| name = Ars Technica
| logo = [[Image:Ars Technica logo.jpg]]
| screenshot = [[Image:Ars Technica 10 18 2007.png|Ars Technica main page as of 2007-10-18.]]
| caption = Ars Technica main page as of [[2007-10-18]].
| url = http://arstechnica.com/
| commercial = Yes
| type = Technology news & information
| registration =
| owner = [[Condé Nast Publications]]
| author = [[Ken "Caesar" Fisher]]
| launch date = 1998
| current status =
| revenue = [[Ars Technica#Revenue|See below]]
}}
'''Ars Technica''' ({{pronEng|ˌɑrz ˈtɛknɨkə}}, Latin for "Art of Technology")<ref name=latin>{{cite web|url=http://arstechnica.com/site/about.ars|title=About Ars Technica|author=|publisher=Ars Technica|date=|accessdate=2008-03-16}}</ref> is a [[technology]]-related [[website]] that caters to [[personal computer|PC]] enthusiasts, covering technology, [[science]], and [[video game|gaming]] news along with editorial comment and analysis. Started in 1998 by [[Ken "Caesar" Fisher]], Ars Technica is headquartered in [[Malden, Massachusetts|Malden]], [[Massachusetts]].<ref>{{cite web|url=http://arstechnica.com/etc/subscribe/premier-agreement.html|title=Ars Technica Subscription Agreement|date=2003-12-26|accessdate=2006-12-25|publisher=Ars Technica}}</ref> The site was independently owned until it was acquired by [[Condé Nast Publications]] in May 2008.<ref>{{cite web|title=Geeks Crash a House of Fashion|url=http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/19/business/media/19carr.html|date=2008-05-19|accessdate=2008-05-20|publisher=[[New York Times]]}}</ref>


The main content is a [[blog]]-style presentation of news stories and commentary, interspersed with advertising. Featured articles are less frequent but go into more depth.
'''Please add new comments below.'''


It styles itself as ''"Serving the Technologist for over 8x10<sup>-2</sup> centuries."''
----


==POV map==
== Ars Front Page ==
The Ars Technica Front Page has two main sections: ''From The News Desk'' and ''Features''. ''The News Desk'' typically consists of short articles featuring analysis of technology and science-related news, with occasional forays into sci-tech related political commentary. ''The News Desk'' came under scrutiny in March 2006, when IPDemocracy.com blogger Cynthia Brumfield accused Ars Technica of using material from her site without attribution <ref>[http://www.ipdemocracy.com/archives/001363dubious_blogosphere_web_journalism_ethics.php IP Democracy<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>. Similar charges surfaced again in July 2007<ref>[http://www.duncanriley.com/2007/07/17/does-ars-technica-rip-every-story-without-credit/ duncanriley.com » Does Ars Technica rip every story without credit?<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>, and May 2008<ref>[http://www.parislemon.com/2008/05/another-classic-rip-off-job-by-ars.html ParisLemon: Another Classic Rip-Off Job By Ars Technica<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>.


The ''Features'' section is sub-divided into two subsections:
Dera Chris, the Rusian user bestalex has taken your map and modified it into POV version [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:South_Ossetia_overview_map.png], first of all its not Tskhinval but Tskhinvali, Znaur but Znauri, and Akhalgori. These are official names and according to most english language based sources. Can you please correct the POV version and try to convince that Russian user to cease his POV pushing by chopping off "i" from the city names? Thanks a lot. [[User:Iberieli|Iberieli]] ([[User talk:Iberieli|talk]]) 03:10, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
:Thanks for letting me know, the map has been reverted. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 19:22, 18 August 2008 (UTC)


*''From the journals'' contains a selection of recent posts from ''[[Ars Technica#Journals.Ars|Journals.Ars]]''.
==RFAR notification==
Hi. I have posted a request for arbitration of [[User:Elonka]] on the [[WP:RFAR]] page. [[User:Bishonen|Bishonen]] | [[User talk:Bishonen|talk]] 20:18, 23 August 2008 (UTC).


*Below the journals posts are a selection of recent featured articles such as in-depth features on science and technology issues, regular columns (such as those relating to [[Linux]] and [[Mac OS X]]), hardware and software reviews, and the ''Ars System Guide'' - a regular feature that advises readers on which components to pick when building their own PCs, whatever their budget.
==Speedy==
Way back in 2004 you uploaded [[:Image:Vesuvius wright.jpg]]. There is an exact copy now on the commons, so I've put it up for Speedy. Just thought I'd give you a heads up. --[[User:Falcorian|Falcorian]]&nbsp;<sup><small>[[User_talk:Falcorian|(talk)]]</small></sup> 02:00, 24 August 2008 (UTC)


Links at the top of the front page provide access to deeper areas of the site, including regularly updated pages relating to subjects such as ''Technology and Culture'', ''CPU Theory & Praxis'', ''Hardware'', etc. The content of articles often overlap the various categories, with non-column articles tending to be more technical in nature.
==[[Nahum Shahaf]]==
I was surprised to see you edit-warring at [[Nahum Shahaf]], to re-insert material that called a BLP subject by a pejorative term.[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nahum_Shahaf&diff=234174900&oldid=234174149][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nahum_Shahaf&diff=234186624&oldid=234177457] Your edit summary said it was "reliably-sourced criticism",[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nahum_Shahaf&diff=prev&oldid=234174900] but no, an opinion column with a passing mention, is not a reliable source, especially when the text in the Wikipedia article does not even match what was in the column.[http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull&cid=1211872839035] I have removed the information from the article, and given my reasoning at the talkpage. Please do not re-insert the information unless you have better sources. Thanks, --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 20:51, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
:Lucky there's no silly 0RR on this article, lest information like this be kept in, regardless of consensus, blp and other ''real'' Wikipedia policy, now is it...hmmm? [[User:Shot info|Shot info]] ([[User talk:Shot info|talk]]) 21:37, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
::ChrisO and Elonka -- I've commented on this question and added some info on reliable sources, at article Talk. Thanks. Best wishes to both of you. [[User:HG|HG]] | [[User talk:HG|Talk]] 21:40, 25 August 2008 (UTC) <s>fyi ChrisO -- please see the discussion on "conspiracy theorist" -- I've added a supporting source, on the one hand, but on the other hand I think your specific wording would need to be further qualified or contextualized. (e.g. "mainstream" is not fitting). [[User:HG|HG]] | [[User talk:HG|Talk]] 13:40, 26 August 2008 (UTC)</s>


==Journals.Ars==
==Just letting you know==


''Journals.Ars'' is a section of the site where Ars staff writers post shorter, less formal articles discussing sci-tech news and rumors, often with more light-hearted commentary. The journals are categorized into six distinct topics: ''Infinite Loop'' ([[Apple Inc.|Apple]]-centric), ''One Microsoft Way'' ([[Microsoft]]-centric), ''Open Ended'' ([[open source software]]-centric), ''Kit'' (Hardware-centric), ''Nobel Intent'' (science-centric), and ''Opposable Thumbs'' (video game and technology gadget-centric).
You have been mentioned on [[User talk:Jimbo Wales]] by an anonymous editor who wants Jimbo to de-sysop you. Just letting you know. Cheers, Erik the <font color="red">[[User:Erik the Red 2|Red]]</font> 2 <small>(<font color= "maroon">[[User Talk:Erik the Red 2|AVE]]</font>·<font color= "orange">[[Special:Contributions/Erik the Red 2|CAESAR]]</font>)</small> 22:28, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
: (cross-posted here and at Jimbo's page) It appears to be true that ChrisO misused admin tools, by protecting (and unprotecting) the page in February 2008[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Countries_of_Europe&diff=192782747&oldid=192780097] and April 2008,[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Countries_of_Europe&diff=203243660&oldid=203243631][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Countries_of_Europe&diff=203243594&oldid=203242911][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Countries_of_Europe&diff=203243631&oldid=203243594] but I have seen no ''recent'' abuse of tools on [[Template:Countries of Europe]], and ChrisO hasn't even edited the template since April (though he is still active on the talkpage). Asking Jimbo to de-sysop, based on something that happened a few months ago, seems a bit extreme, not to mention that Jimbo prefers that the community handles these kinds of situations (except in very very rare cases such as with the de-sysopping of [[User:Bedford]]). I do agree that ChrisO should not have been using tools at that template though, since he was not [[WP:UNINVOLVED|an uninvolved admin]]. Other than that, this issue is fairly stale. If there are other cases of ChrisO abusing tools, the best way to handle it is to bring them up (with diffs) at his talkpage. If the problems continue, a thread at [[WP:ANI]] or a [[WP:RFC|Request for Comment]] would be the proper way to proceed. If there was community consensus that ChrisO had abused tools, he could choose to resign, or, as a last resort, the community could request de-sysopping via the [[WP:ARBCOM|Arbitration Committee]]. --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 00:57, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


Readers are able to add their own comments to ''Journals.Ars'' articles.
==Courtesy notice==
I have filed a request for arbitration where you are a named party. I am very concerned by Elonka's attempts to initiate a discussion of your desysopping. Disputes should not be allowed to fester. Hopefully formal dispute resolution will bring this controversy to an end. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 07:59, 29 August 2008 (UTC)


== Ars OpenForum ==
== Nominations for the Military history WikiProject coordinator election ==
Ars Technica also maintains the ''OpenForum'', an [[internet forum]] dedicated primarily to discussion of technology-related topics. The forum is divided into many sub-forums covering a range of subjects, from specific operating system and networking discussion areas to more general forums dealing with business, socio-political issues and recreational pursuits. In common with the main site, the OpenForum contains many references to [[ancient Rome]], both in the titles of the sub-forums and the ranks assigned to each user.
The [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Coordinators|Military history WikiProject coordinator]] selection process is starting. We are aiming to elect nine coordinators to serve for the next six months; if you are interested in running, please sign up [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Coordinators/September 2008|here]] by 23:59 (UTC) on September 14!<br /><small>This has been an automated delivery by [[User:BrownBot|BrownBot]] ([[User talk:BrownBot|talk]]) 21:45, 1 September 2008 (UTC)</small>


Forum Members hold a number of "Arsmeets" every year so that members and readers alike can get together and meet one another in person.
== The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXX (August 2008) ==
The '''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Outreach/Newsletter August 2008|August 2008 issue]]''' of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.<br /><small>This has been an automated delivery by [[User:BrownBot|BrownBot]] ([[User talk:BrownBot|talk]]) 22:42, 2 September 2008 (UTC)</small>


With over ten million posts and 100,000 registered forum users, the OpenForum is an extremely large forum. Big-Boards.com, a website which lists a selection of forums, ranks it in the top 200 of their selection.<ref>[http://rankings.big-boards.com/?p=5 Forums Rankings - all software forums, all languages language, website ranking by posts<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>
== Daily Mirror ==
Please continue this discussion on [[WP:RSN]], not my Talk page. [[User:Canadian Monkey|Canadian Monkey]] ([[User talk:Canadian Monkey|talk]]) 17:11, 3 September 2008 (UTC)


== Revenue ==
==Article on dr Darko Trifunovic==
Ars Technica's operating revenue derives from the following sources:
*Affiliate sales commissions (including "Sale" notices posted under the news section)<ref>[http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20050412-4805.html Insane Dell Inspiron coupon deal ([[United States dollar|US$]]750 off US$1499), take two<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>
*[[Advertising]] on Ars Technica (through [[Federated Media]], approx. US$20 [[cost per mille|CPM]])<ref>[http://www.federatedmedia.net/authors/arstechnica Ars Technica - Federated Media Publishing<!-- Bot generated title -->]</ref>
*User subscription fees
*Sale of Ars Technica-[[brand]]ed merchandise
On [[May 19]] [[2008]] it was announced that the site had been acquired from Ars Technica, LLC (the holding company formed of its founders)<ref>{{cite web | url = http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080519-ars-technica-acquired-by-conde-nast-the-low-down.html | title = Ars Technica acquired by Condé Nast: the low-down | publisher = Ars Technica | date = 2008-05-19 | accessdate = 2008-05-20}}</ref><ref>{{cite web|title=Breaking: Condé Nast/Wired Acquires Ars Technica|url=http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/05/16/breaking-conde-nastwired-acquires-ars-technica/|date=2008-05-16|accessdate=2008-05-16|publisher=[[TechCrunch]]}}</ref> by [[Condé Nast Publications]].


== References ==
Dear Cris,
{{reflist}}


== External links ==
I find out that this article is badly supported and that many quotation is just fiction without any backing. Furthermore, I found out that article is locked for correction. Also in section "Discussion" I find out several important info on dr Darko Trifunovic well supported by appropriate sources, but this info is not included as integral part of article. Having whole situation as such, my free conclusion is that whole article is purposely constructed as it is. What we can do to improve quality of the article? Many thanks. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/89.216.166.125|89.216.166.125]] ([[User talk:89.216.166.125|talk]]) 09:14, 6 September 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
*[http://www.arstechnica.com Official website]
*[http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/forums Ars OpenForum]


[[Category:Technology websites]]
:First, I'd suggest that you stop filling up the talk page with nonsense such as "Look like Wikipadia serve Jihadist and Terrorist purposes". Talk pages are not supposed to be used for off-topic purposes or to make attacks on people - see [[Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines]]. Second, don't add your personal commentary to the article like you did in your last edits. Third, please take the time to read [[Wikipedia:Neutral point of view]]; this is our single most important policy. We're not allowed to either praise or denigrate our subjects, but only to reflect what [[WP:V|reliable, verifiable third-party sources]] say about them. Please see also [[Wikipedia:Biographies of living people]] for our policy on that topic. Finally, if you have any '''specific''' changes that you want to make, based on reliable, verifiable sources, please post them at [[Talk:Darko Trifunović]] and we can discuss them. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 09:58, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
[[Category:News websites]]


[[it:Ars Technica]]
== Fringe theory ==
[[sv:Ars Technica]]

To claim that the Iranian national identity was somehow formed in 1970's is fringe nonsense. The "political propaganda" stuff doesn't belong in the lead either, I already discussed this in depth with Dab. I did not revert your edits, so show some courtesy in return, let me finish my edits, before making reverts. --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 16:21, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

:If you continue to delete sourced, relevant material from expert sources because you have a POV disagreement with it you ''will'' be blocked. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 16:23, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

:: Are you threading me with a block in the middle of a content dispute? --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 16:35, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

:::You're violating a swathe of Wikipedia's policies, particularly the most important one - [[WP:NPOV]]. Let's be clear about this. We are meant to "represent fairly, and as far as possible without bias, all significant views that have been published by reliable sources." You are ''not'' supposed to delete sources because you have a personal disagreement with what they say. The sources you've been deleting are citations of leading experts - Sir [[Max Mallowan]] and [[Neil MacGregor]], who, let's not forget, is the director of the museum in which the Cyrus Cylinder is located. Deleting sourced material because you don't agree with it is a severe violation of NPOV and will get you blocked by another admin if you don't cease. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 16:41, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:::: No I am not. Just because something is sourced, it doesn't mean that it merits an inclusion in the lead of an article. Others can also cheery-pick a source saying "Cyrus was awesome blah blah bah" and put it in the lead. The lead is suppose to be a summery of the article in a NPOV fashion, not a place to quote cherry-picked sources. --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 16:42, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
::::: What is your excuse for [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cyrus_cylinder&diff=237086049&oldid=237085488 this edit]? I repeat: you do not delete expert sources because you have a personal disagreement with what they say. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 16:53, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:::::: That's a violation of [[WP:FRINGE]]. Show me a serious academic that claims that Iranian identity was "newly constructed" in 1970's. If you're gonna quote this revisionist nonsense, you should put in a quotation mark. --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 17:03, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
::::::: Let me get this right - the [[Director of the British Museum]] is a ''fringe source?'' -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 17:10, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:::::::: His assertion is a fringe theory, not supported any serious academic. Do you seriously believe that the Iranian national identity constructed in 1970's? --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 17:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
::::::::: It's not my business to "believe" anything here. The director of the institution in which the cylinder is housed - who is himself a leading scholar and curator - has commented on the "human rights charter" viewpoint in a mainstream academic publication. His position and expertise make his viewpoint notable and significant. You're effectively elevating your own personal opinion, as a non-expert, above the professional opinion of someone who's better placed than almost anyone else to comment on the cylinder. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 17:28, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
Leading scholar of what? He's just an art historian, not an Iranolgist or a serious scholar of Iran or Achaemenids to be able to propose theories on "newly constructed Iranian national identity". My position is based on what other serious academics say about Iranian national identity. The notion that the Iranian national identity was somehow invented in 19070's is laughable. I am confident that you're familiar enough with the history of the region to know this as well. But you're being academically dishonest, and overlooking this very important detail. --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 17:50, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:Once again, you're promoting your own personal opinion. I repeat: NPOV ''requires'' us to report significant published viewpoints in reliable sources, whether or not you personally agree with them. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 17:55, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:: That doesn't apply to fringe theories. However, I proposed that we restore his comment, and put his assertions in quotation marks, to clearly attribute it to him. Do you agree with this compromise? --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 18:02, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
::: I'll find the exact words and restore them to the article. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 18:07, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
:::: Great, please put them in quotation marks. If you check the history of that page, you'll see that I have done the same thing with the Iranian POV stuff, and I have had problems with Iranian editors as well. If you hadn't vilified me, threatened me with a block, and assumed a bit of good faith, we would not have wasted two hours arguing over nothing. Cheers. --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 18:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
::::: I didn't threaten anybody. But you need to be aware that deleting material because you don't personally agree with it simply is not done. If it's a reliably sourced significant viewpoint then there's no good reason to delete it. You might wish to have a look at [[Wikipedia:Writing for the enemy]]. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 18:19, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

A note on Iranian national identity: the belief that the last Shah tried to redefine national identity following his coronation in 1967 to de-emphasise indigenous Shi'ite traditions and to promote a pre-Islamic Persian/monarchist past is ''completely mainstream'' in academia, and belongs in the lead of the Cyrus cylinder article, as that artefact was a part of the process. --<span style="font-family:Georgia">[[User:Relata refero|Relata refero]] ([[User talk:Relata refero|disp.]])</span> 19:11, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

== the Balkans need you (again) :) ==

Chris,

I had left for a time [[international reaction to the 2008 declaration of independence by Kosovo]], trusting you would dig through the evidence and help infuse NPOV content to this hijacked article. But it didn't happen.

During my collaborative work with Ian and others, our lone pro-Serbia (as opposed to pro-accurate Wikipedia) nemesis caused the article to be locked.

Could you at least come help making meritorious points in the discussion? At present we have editprotect requests, all consensual, except for the lone ranger opposing. The consensus-building needs more merit to be infused in the discussions. Hence this note. I hope this does not constitute canvassing. :) --[[User:Mareklug|Mareklug]] <sup>[[User talk:Mareklug|<b>talk</b>]]</sup> 17:16, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

:Anything to save me from Iranian POV-pushers. ;-) I'll take a look - thanks for the note. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 17:17, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

== A question ==

With all due respect, your additions to the Cyrus Cylinder all contain negative connotations about Cyrus. If this page was related to a living person, some would call this a character assassination. In particular, the interpretation section is nothing but cherry-picked assertions about "how evil" Cyrus really was. In all fairness, so you honestly think that your edits are in line with [[WP:NPOV]]? --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 18:43, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

:I hardly think it's "cherry-picked assertions about "how evil Cyrus really was"". I'm simply reflecting mainstream scholarly views. I can assure you that I'm not trying to portray Cyrus in any particular light - I honestly don't have a personal view about his qualities. As a matter of fact, I don't believe that the material I added does have negative connotations. One of the greatest mistakes you can make in writing about history is to judge the past by the standards of the present. No doubt Cyrus himself would have seen his actions in a positive light - he was simply acting in a way that fitted his political needs at the time. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 19:51, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

== It shows ==

It tells everywhere in your edits, that precision of close control of sources by a ranging and erudite mind, is something rare these days, and can't but remind certain readers of the sadly dwindling classrooms where these techniques are the staple of a humanistic ''forma mentis''. I don't doubt that you caught the allusion in my use of 'nebulous'. You can wear its source ([[Juvenal]]10:1-4.)as a description of your own palmary contribution to this encyclopedia (I have long considered throwing a barnstar your way, but I don't know how to do it properly)

''Omnibus in terris, quae sunt a Gadibus usque''</BR>
''Auroram et Gangen, pauci dinoscere possunt''</BR>
''vera bona atque illis multum diversa, remota''</BR>
''erroris nebula''.</BR>

If you can find a barnstar format to fit that, give it to me and I'll gladly post it on your page.

Best wishes, Chris [[User:Nishidani|Nishidani]] ([[User talk:Nishidani|talk]]) 09:21, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

== Band name ==

I prefer "citation needed", but then that's been done - [[xkcd]]. ;) [[User:SesquipedalianVerbiage|<font color="#CC7722" face="Papyrus">'''Verbal'''</font>]] <small>[[User talk:SesquipedalianVerbiage#top|<font color="grey" face="Papyrus">chat</font>]]</small> 08:20, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
:''POV Warrior''! - or ''Uninvolved Admin '' :-) [[User:Shot info|Shot info]] ([[User talk:Shot info|talk]]) 08:44, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

== Thank you ==

{| style="border: 1px solid gray; background-color: #fdffe7;"
|rowspan="2" valign="middle" | [[Image:Random_Acts_of_Kindness_Barnstar.png|100px]]
|rowspan="2" |
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" | '''The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | For your assistance in addressing the real-world stalking that arose from a year-old wiki dispute, thank you. And good-bye. [[User:Pfagerburg|Pfagerburg]] ([[User talk:Pfagerburg|talk]]) 02:25, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
|}

==Image copyright problem with Image:Frontier elite2 screenshot.gif==
Thanks for uploading [[:Image:Frontier elite2 screenshot.gif]]. You've indicated that the image is being used under a claim of [[WP:NFC|fair use]], but you have not provided an adequate explanation for why it meets [[WP:NFCC|Wikipedia's requirements for such images]]. In particular, for each page the image is used on, the image must have an [[Wikipedia:Non-free use rationale guideline|explanation]] linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Can you please check

:* That there is a [[Wikipedia:Non-free use rationale guideline|non-free use rationale]] on the image's description page for each article the image is used in.
:* That every article it is used on is linked to from its description page.
<!-- Additional 10c list header goes here -->

This is an automated notice by [[User:FairuseBot|FairuseBot]]. For assistance on the image use policy, see [[Wikipedia:Media copyright questions]]. --[[User:FairuseBot|FairuseBot]] ([[User talk:FairuseBot|talk]]) 22:33, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

==WP:FTN==
re [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Fringe_theories/Noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=238344197 your comment] -- well, yes, but we need to make perfectly clear that the "all POVs are equal" or "all sources are of equal value" approach is in direct violation of [[WP:NPOV]] (via [[WP:DUE]]), and could anyone embracing it please step forward, hand over their admin buttons and leave the project. Everyone is free to privately entertain any views or ideologies they choose, but when it comes to editing behavior, Wikipedia administrators acting in direct violation of Wikipedia core principles is something we should not tolerate. If the reason is cognitive limitations ([[Hanlon's razor]]), we are called upon to be patient and understanding -- these are unpaid volunteers after all. If the reason is downright disagreement with what Wikipedia is trying to do, the only answer can be, you can't be an admin and oppose project goals (you can't even be an editor and oppose project goal, although in practice you get to prance around for months or years before this is acted upon). [[User:Dbachmann|dab]] <small>[[User_talk:Dbachmann|(𒁳)]]</small> 15:15, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

==Orphaned non-free image (Image:Xenu nip-tuck.jpg)==
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If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "[[Special:MyContributions|my contributions]]" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free images not used in any '''articles''' will be deleted after seven days, as described on [[wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#Images.2FMedia|criteria for speedy deletion]]. Thank you. <small>Do you want to [[Template:Bots#Message notification opt out|opt out]] of receiving this notice?</small><!-- Template:Di-orphaned fair use-notice --> [[User:SchuminWeb|SchuminWeb]] ([[User talk:SchuminWeb|Talk]]) 19:59, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

== Military history WikiProject coordinator election ==
The September 2008 [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Coordinators|Military history WikiProject coordinator]] election has begun. We will be selecting nine coordinators to serve for the next six months from a pool of fourteen candidates. Please [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Coordinators/September 2008|vote here]] by September 30!<br /><small>This has been an automated delivery by [[User:BrownBot|BrownBot]] ([[User talk:BrownBot|talk]]) 21:29, 15 September 2008 (UTC)</small>

== My RfA ==

{|style="background-color: #E6E6FA; padding: 3px; border: 1px solid #888;"
|[[Image:Janitor's bucket with mop.jpg|100px]]
|style="background-color: #def; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #888;"|Thank you for supporting me in my RfA, which passed with a count of (166/43/7). I appreciate your comments and in my actions as an '''[[Wikipedia:Administrators|administrator]]''' I will endeavor to maintain the trust you have placed in me. I am honored by your trust and your support. Thank you, '''[[User:Cirt|Cirt]]''' ([[User talk:Cirt|talk]]) 02:39, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
|}

== Zadar section Recent History discussion ==

I kindly ask you to participate in the discussion about [[Zadar]] article recent history section in order to achieve a more [[NPOV]] version. I feel that current version is one sided and has issues that need to be resolved. Thank you. [[Special:Contributions/78.30.150.253|78.30.150.253]] ([[User talk:78.30.150.253|talk]]) 13:32, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

==Speedy deletion of [[:Image:Iraq map najaf.png]]==
[[Image:Ambox warning_pn.svg|48px|left]] A tag has been placed on [[:Image:Iraq map najaf.png]] requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under [[WP:CSD#I8|section I8 of the criteria for speedy deletion]], because it is available as a bit-for-bit identical copy on the [[Commons:Main Page|Wikimedia Commons]] under the same name, or all references to the image on Wikipedia have been updated to point to the title used at Commons.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding <code>{{tl|hangon}}</code> to '''the top of [[:Image:Iraq map najaf.png|the page that has been nominated for deletion]]''' (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag), coupled with adding a note on '''[[ Talk:Image:Iraq map najaf.png|the talk page]]''' explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for ''speedy'' deletion, if the article meets the criterion it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the article does get deleted, you can contact [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators who will provide copies of deleted articles|one of these admins]] to request that a copy be emailed to you. <!-- Template:Db-nowcommons-notice --> <!-- Template:Db-csd-notice-custom --> -&nbsp;[[User:AWeenieMan|AWeenieMan]]&nbsp;([[User talk:AWeenieMan|talk]]) 18:26, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

==Hi==
Hi, ChrisO, LarnoMan told me of your mishaps, and this is his view, as I don't have a view of your mishaps yet. But I think the Ancient Mesopotamia.. book you referenced was wrong, I read p. 113 and it did not say what you wrote on Wikipedia, and you added unnessary OR to your own writings, I JUST improved it. So here are the points;

*First, you say Grayson is supported by more historians than Lambert, BUT you forget that the more historians still believe in the OUTDATED TRANSLATION.

*Second, Lambert is the superior or teacher or mentor I think of Grayson, so if he discovered Grayson, his students translation is wrong, then its OUTDATED, Wikipedia was made to look for the truth with some reference, not look for the OUTDATED truth with a lot of reference, your arguement is missing the point.

*Thirdly, for some reason, you use the word PROPAGANDA too much, its intresting that this propaganda is supported by the Torah, and other Babylonian texts, WITH the Jews migration back to Israel, which histogeographers now do not doubt. You must really read the Cyrus Cylinder yourself to realize he is refering to the CITY of Babylon being liberated, which he liberates the Jews that is why the call him the Messiah, but he's not Jewish so they still believe the Messiah has not come yet. And that he is NOT refering to ALL of the citizens of the Babylonian EMPIRE being liberated.

*Finally, it is fact that Cyrus did ''defeat the soldiers'', so why believe in the OUTDATED translation that say's he ''slaughtered the people''? And, Akkad is by Opis, so the soldiers were composed of the people of Akkad, and if you look in the casualties section, I before had believed in the wrong translation and put tens to hundreds of thousands dead on the Babylonian side, which I will change soon.

So, I am sorry if I'm sounding harsh and taking sides, it is time to take side or be on the side, I think your not taking any sides to be fair and balanced, but WHY be fair and balanced to the wrong translation? Finally, anyways I greatly appreciate the time you took to read this, and don't forget I CAN make this longer, I am putting the main points here, and sorry if I had offended you earlier, if you could just give me a worthy response I would be honored, thank you.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 08:46, 18 September 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

I WAS going to support my vandalism with sourcers very soon but you reverted them.

== Ariobarza ==

Frustrating, isn't it. He seems a nice guy, editing in good faith but still confused over policy and guidelines. I've given up on his articles for a while, I've had more rewarding things to do on Wikipedia. But he really needs to learn how to write articles. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 09:05, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

== Possible sock ==

I just noticed that you blocked [[user:Sinbad Barron]]. I don't want to go on a fishing expedition, but [[user:Billy Bollox]] has an awfully similar user page and area of interest. I feel the duck test is in order... // [[User:dchall1|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#006400">'''Chris'''</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:dchall1|<span style="color:#006400">(complaints)</span>]]•[[:Special:Contributions/dchall1|<span style="color:#006400">(contribs)</span>]]</sup> 21:31, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

:Yes, I noticed the same too after I blocked BB. I'll put in a checkuser request. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 06:59, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

::And another - [[User:Billy_Bollinja]]. At least he makes it easy. // [[User:dchall1|<span style="font-variant:small-caps;color:#006400">'''Chris'''</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:dchall1|<span style="color:#006400">(complaints)</span>]]•[[:Special:Contributions/dchall1|<span style="color:#006400">(contribs)</span>]]</sup> 11:16, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

:::Blocked. Persistent, isn't he? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 11:25, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

== People's names ==

I'd really appreciate it if you'd go back and strike out a comment you made about a username, that's a pet peeve of mine, someone messing around with someone else's name. It's also uncivil too, isn't it? [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 13:18, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

:Hmm, yes, you're right - done. I think you can understand my frustration though! Where do we find these people? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 13:20, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

::I do, and I was about to revert my edit when you added this. But we need to restrain ourselves, especially when dealing with people who don't show restraint. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 13:23, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

::inFIghting above, But You know its this streched truth and riduculus accusations that make a situation more worse than it already is, like saying that I dont know what peer view is, which I was talking about how good the peer view Lamberts thing was, not what is peer view itself, and this calling of names like nationa... you know I'm tired of saying that word, this escalating of disputes furthermore hinders wikipedias goal, and progress. I came up with a solution if you read the last thing I wrote in the Opis talk page, if you read then you would not say suchs thing, so if you could see it, that would be great huh? Thank you BUDDY'L POW! YOU must read it, its actually really well written really, really!--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 08:14, 21 September 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

==furthermore==
WHEN I SAID, Leave it to the audience to decide what is the best translation, I ment people reading wikipedia, not us. I am totally against the idea that WE choose the best translation, as were not the academics. Im in the centerist, I would include all translations in a free of bias matter and write pros and cons of different historians, and let the people wonder about it. ''This is almost the repeat of what I said on the Opis talk page, WHICH I'M not SURE IF YOU UNDERSTOOD WHAT I MEANT, I HOPE YOU DO NOW,'' thanks.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 08:29, 21 September 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza

== Socks? ==

Hi,

[[User:Sinbad Barron]], [[User:Billy Bollox]]: please see their editing patterns and time when one was blocked-the other appeared. Is this a case for checkuser? Cheers, --[[User:TheFEARgod|<font color="#003399">The'''FE'''</font><font color="red">'''AR'''god</font>]] ([[User talk:TheFEARgod|'''Ч''']]) 12:16, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

:I've blocked them both indefinitely - they're clearly socks. Please do let me know if you see any fresh socks being created. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 12:41, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

== Please see ==

Please see [[Wikipedia:Conflict of interest/Noticeboard]] regarding [[the eXile]] and [[user:Dsol]]]]

[[Special:Contributions/24.127.162.147|24.127.162.147]] ([[User talk:24.127.162.147|talk]]) 22:15, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

==Your image of War Office==
Thank you for the image on Wiki Commons of the above. I've used it in the article about Sir Edward [[Louis Spears]]. Unfortunately, there are no pix on Commons of 3-4 Carlton House Gardens, the HQ of the Free French. There is, I believe, a statue outside the house and also a blue plaque. It would be useful to have it uploaded to Wikipedia Commons. Are you often out and about in London? If so, might you be able to help? [[User:Mikeo1938|Mikeo1938]] ([[User talk:Mikeo1938|talk]]) 11:44, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

:Yes, I'm sure I could manage that. I should be able to do it at the weekend, if you can hang on that long. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 12:44, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

::Thank you. There is no immediate rush. A request for such a pic has been on the Discussion page of the de Gaulle article for months but no one has responded! If you could get 3 shots that would be VG. Perhaps the plaque, the statue of CDG and also a shot of the building. [[User:Mikeo1938|Mikeo1938]] ([[User talk:Mikeo1938|talk]]) 13:37, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

:::Don't want to push my luck ... but if ever you are near 28 Queen Anne's Gate, could you take a shot of the house, pse? This was the home of Ronald Tree and was often used for meetings of 'The Eden Group'. Apparently there was a division bell at the house and so Members could hurry back when it rang. Louis Spears was a member of the Eden Group; it would be nice to include a picture of the house in the section which mentions same. Thank you. [[User:Mikeo1938|Mikeo1938]] ([[User talk:Mikeo1938|talk]]) 17:47, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

==Calculating size of images==
Is there a way to calculate the total KB size of the all various images in an article? Presumably the size indicated with the file in Commons is far greater than the size of the image when it's on a page. I ask because I see that images do not count as 'readable text' when assessing the size (length) of an article. Your comments would be appreciated.[[User:Mikeo1938|Mikeo1938]] ([[User talk:Mikeo1938|talk]]) 22:35, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
::OK, I've found out what to do from one of the Help pages. It seems that the images do not count towards the size. Thanks anyway.[[User:Mikeo1938|Mikeo1938]] ([[User talk:Mikeo1938|talk]]) 22:49, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

== Creazy Suit ==

Hello, {{BASEPAGENAME}}. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents]] regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. {{#if:|The discussion is about the topic [[:{{{1}}}]].}} <!--Template:ANI-notice--> Thank you. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 04:36, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

== Ariobarza ==

Hi - please see my comments about him on the RfC. He's different. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 10:59, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

== Re: ==

I can, but can ''you''? First of all, you should know that this is not a one-way street. From the moment I have met you, you have been rude and hostile toward me, calling ''me'', an ethnic Kurd whose father had been in prison for 7 years during both the Shah and Khomeini's regimes, an "Iranian nationalist" and "Shah lover", and lumping me together with anyone and everyone you could, including a teenage girl who I had never heard of until last week, all because we disagreed on a subjective matter. Now you're even labeling KhoiKhoi, an American Jew, an "Iranian nationalist" too. Has it ever occurred to you that you could be wrong sometimes? The impression I have got from is that you have a preconceived opinion on certain subjects, and then transfer that opinion into an essay with a thesis statement. Can you moderate your behavior? Can you keep an open mind toward the opposing editors and respect [[WP:AGF]]? Can you respect the [[WP:NPOV|neutral point of view]] and [[WP:UNDO]], and stop cherry-picking sources to prove a thesis? I am willing to work toward a compromise, are you? --[[User:CreazySuit|CreazySuit]] ([[User talk:CreazySuit|talk]]) 19:22, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

== I desperately need your help ==
Hi ChrisO
I really need your help. There is this one administrator [[jayjig]] that keeps on abusing his powers, basically his edits are all POV and pro-Zionist, he has a strong network of Zionist administrators that are working with him and they are all ganging up on me!!!!no joke..the problem is that for this article [[Syrian military presence in Lebanon]] jayjig keeps on reverting the NPOV title to the POV title [[Syrian occupation of Lebanon]]..Now ChrisO if you read the discussion page you will notice that almost half of the editors disagree with the title [[Syrian occupation of Lebanon]]..therefore there is NO consesus that agrees with the latter title...but jayjig keeps erroneuslly saying that there is consensus..where there isn't....and another thing ..he keeps on deleting my sourced refernces because they are not compatible with his political views....I'm telling you ChrisO I have never seen such a POV administrator like Jayjig...and so I went and spoke to another administartor called Shell and expalined to her the situation...and it turns out she's working with jayjig..she went ahead and protected the page with the POV title......anyways can you please speak to the higher-ups...this is very frustrating.[[User:George Al-Shami|George Al-Shami]] ([[User talk:George Al-Shami|talk]]) 04:54, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

== Third opinion ==

Hi, bringing a serious matter to your attention. The situation of the article [[Religious violence in Orissa]] is deteriorating day by day with accusations and counter-accusations against the editors actively involved in the page. You can read the discussion in the talk page. A proposal was made to bring a consensus by a totally uninvolved user who will be able to give a neutral opinion. The page is currently protected and there is a fear that it may be the wrong version. The editors in this page are desperately seeking a third opinion. Can you help. '''[[User:Otolemur crassicaudatus|<font color="002bb8">Otolemur crassicaudatus</font>]]''' ([[User talk:Otolemur crassicaudatus|talk]]) 10:56, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

== Re:Civility Warning ==

I am sorry if you interpreted my comments as suggestive in any way of anti-semitism. They were ''certainly'' not meant that way at all. I was rather implying a pro-Palestinian nationalist perspective, much like your comment regarding "Iranian nationalists" eg here [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Fringe_theories/Noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=241095445]. It is true that when you believe that someone is editing from a certain perspective, it can be virtually impossible to hear where they are actually coming from, or to give proper credence to their view. I agree that it is best to keep an open mind about others' motivations, and try to understand where they are coming from, rather than attach labels to them and their editing. I will certainly try to keep that in mind. Civility is always the best course. [[User:Tundrabuggy|Tundrabuggy]] ([[User talk:Tundrabuggy|talk]]) 16:43, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

:Best to avoid these types of discussions and focus on the content itself. Content might be promoting a pro-X agenda/narrative in an undue fashion; the editor himself, however, is free to hold his opinions without being attacked over them (as long as he's not trying to be purposefully offensive). <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 06:34, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

==Block==
For edit-warring at [[Battle of Opis]],[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Battle_of_Opis&diff=241614297&oldid=241613397][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Battle_of_Opis&diff=241641381&oldid=241639700][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Battle_of_Opis&diff=241646385&oldid=241646312][http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Battle_of_Opis&diff=241652546&oldid=241651564] I am blocking your account access for 3 hours. Please take a break, thanks. --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 23:51, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

:While I think it was inadvisable for Elonka to take action, given our previous history, I agree that I did inadvertantly violate 3RR and the block was justified on that basis. I won't be posting an unblock request and I don't want to see this turn into yet more drama. Please leave it at this - no more needs to be said here.

:(I'd be grateful if someone could copy this to [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents/Battle of Opis‎]], where it's already being discussed. I don't want people wasting even more time on this.) -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 01:09, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
:: Chris, if you want, I'll just undo the block, if you're willing to stay off editing the Opis article for a couple hours? --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 01:14, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
::: I can guarantee at least six hours away from the article, as I'm off to bed now. So yes, feel free to unblock. I doubt I'm going to be doing anything more with the article for a while anyway, since the remaining parts of it need some research (and books) I haven't yet completed. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 01:16, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
:::: Righto, the block's undone (though there may be a lingering autoblock, so let me know if there's a problem). Welcome back! :) --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 01:25, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

==Edit warring==
Please stop struggling at [[Battle of Opis]]. Instead, I recommend you request [[WP:M|mediation]] of content disputes, or seek [[WP:ANI|administrative help]] for behavioral problems. Your continued reverting only serves to muddy the waters and prolong the problem. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 13:54, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

== New vandal ==

Hello Chris. I wish to bring something to your attention if I may. I'm not 100% sure but I am led to believe that you are an administrator here and so you may be interested to know of the following activities: a comment posted on the Saddam Hussein talk page was aimed directly at me, from a relatively new user by the name of [[User:X Ray Tex]]; the message was the following: [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Saddam_Hussein&diff=241767224&oldid=241180445]. In addition, it appears to me that each and every edit by this user has been unconstructive, provocative and largely POV orientated; and on a very similar tone to that for which others have been blocked. I recently announced that I would refrain from editing political articles, however I still read them, and occasionally revert vandalism or disruptive editing, but only until someone reverts me when which I then retire. Naturally, you may wish to deal with this user; but if I was mistaken in thinking that you are an administrator, I apologise; though could you direct me someone who will deal with this. Many thanks. [[User:Evlekis|Evlekis]] ([[User talk:Evlekis|talk]]) 16:59, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

== Hi! ==

It looks like Sinbad aka Billy bollox aka Billy bolinja has appeared again.[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/X_Ray_Tex] Best regards, [[User:Alaexis|Alæxis]]<sub>[[User_talk:Alaexis|¿question?]]</sub> 17:51, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
:Oh, User:Evlekis has already raised this issue. I'm sorry, I've noticed it only after hitting save page. [[User:Alaexis|Alæxis]]<sub>[[User_talk:Alaexis|¿question?]]</sub> 17:53, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

:Nuked - thanks for the notification. Keep watching the skies, I'm sure he'll be back. In the meantime I'll ask the checkusers to do their stuff to see if we can knock out his IP address. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 18:10, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

== WPK sockpuppet ==

Hello, this user [[User:WPK]] seems to be a sockpuppet of [[User:PKo]]. He keeps editing the [[Greece]] article and has violated the [[3RR]] a number of times. Any chance you can have a look? [[User:Walnutjk|Walnutjk]] ([[User talk:Walnutjk|talk]]) 19:51, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

:Could you possibly explain what makes you think the user is a sockpuppet? (Diffs would help.) -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 19:57, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

::It's pretty obvious, both have a bee in their bonnet about stressing that Greece is partly in Asia, same edits to [[Greece]] and [[List of countries spanning more than one continent]] to that effect [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greece&diff=prev&oldid=241998609], [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greece&diff=236074723&oldid=236066161]; same style, same poor English, same stereotyped arguments on talk pages without ever actually engaging in discussion. Didn't really deny the identity when I told him today on his talk. [[User:Future Perfect at Sunrise|Fut.Perf.]] [[User talk:Future Perfect at Sunrise|☼]] 20:22, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

:::In that case, I recommend a checkuser. If there's one sock there's a good chance there'll be more. Did you see the sockfarm I found the other day? ([[Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Sinbad barron‎]]) -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 20:24, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
:::: Actually, I don't really see it as malicious socking so much as the typical newbie ways of randomly switching accounts. I'd say CU is a bit overkill. In any case, he's easy enough to spot when he hits again. [[User:Future Perfect at Sunrise|Fut.Perf.]] [[User talk:Future Perfect at Sunrise|☼]] 20:33, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
::::: Fair enough. Those are well-watched articles, anyway, so I'm sure any further silliness will be spotted. I've given him a 3RR warning about his edits to [[Greece]] - if he reverts again feel free to block him. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 20:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your help guys. [[User:Walnutjk|Walnutjk]] ([[User talk:Walnutjk|talk]]) 20:50, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

==SAS==

Although I imagine you have reverted the edit about the SAS because it was removed by 'the usual suspect', its doubtful if that sort of rabid nonsense adds anything to the article and it was clearly written some time later than when the terrorists were shot and refers to Ireland not Gibraltar. Here the SAS are seen in a positive light. Can I suggest you review its inclusion sometime in the future? --[[User:Gibnews|Gibnews]] ([[User talk:Gibnews|talk]]) 21:06, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

:Yes, I'll certainly have a look at it. You're right about it being "the usual suspect". Persistent, isn't he? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 21:32, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

==Mountains in Kosovo==
Hi, Chris. An anonymous Serbian edit warrior {{User|70.80.93.11}} is spinning about [[Kosovo]]. In particular, two mountain ranges, [[Šar Mountain]] and [[Kopaonik]], have captured his attention. His edits consist almost solely of sterile reverts of "Kosovo" to "[[Serbia]]" or insisting on the formulation "Kosovo, Serbia", or some such. Can he be cited in accord with the [[Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Kosovo|Arbcom Kosovo]] case? Can you help? [[User:Aramgar|Aramgar]] ([[User talk:Aramgar|talk]]) 22:35, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

== Heyo ==

Sent you a note. Happy new year. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 13:02, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

== Image licensing ==

Hey there...

I am going through a number of images that have some minor licensing issues. I came across [[:Image:Cuckmere haven.jpg]] which you uploaded. The licensing on this image is not complete as it was uploaded many years ago. I wonder if you could follow the link to the image page and correct the licensing with a GFDL license (or other free license). If you have any questions or issues, please drop me a note on my talk page. Thanks. --[[User:Jordan 1972|Jordan 1972]] ([[User talk:Jordan 1972|talk]]) 01:07, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

:No problem, done. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 11:21, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

==HI==
hi Chris, I was just wandering what you think of my new message in the discussion page of Battle of Thermopylae, its called, ''For the sake of arguement''. Please check it out, it is short and easy to understand, thanks.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 17:30, 2 October 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

== Sinbad again ==

Hi! It's rather funny but apparently he's returned - [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Little_XQ]. Regards, [[User:Alaexis|Alæxis]]<sub>[[User_talk:Alaexis|¿question?]]</sub> 11:04, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

:Wow, he's persistent! Blocked. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 18:18, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

== [[Xerxes I of Persia]] ==

Is this [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Xerxes_I_of_Persia&curid=46289&diff=242821361&oldid=242362678#In_the_Bible] the nonense I think it may be. I've reverted this guy before, he wasn't pleased, so I want to check this time. Thanks. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 20:37, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

:I'll have a look at it. I can't say it's a claim I've come across before...

:You might also have a view about [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#Savepasargad.com as a source?]]. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 21:05, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

== My view ==

It seems that you are pushing a particular pov regarding anything to do with [[Cyrus the Great]]. You have been editing the [[Cyrus Cylinder]] to such an extent and with such a view (read: bias) that it has been tagged/criticized for being [[unbalanced]] and [[WP:undue|undue]]. When [[Kaveh Farrokh]] is quoted as a source for the other view, you run an [[AfD]] on his wiki article. When it became clear that the Kaveh Farrokh article would not be deleted, you turn to the [[Persian Golden Lioness Award|award]] he received, and attempted to delete the awarding organisation. Finally, when someone cites a website containing an article by Kaveh Farrokh, you challenge the website on the [[RSN]], where others who are also involved in (many of) these articles, join with you to pan Farrokh as well as the website. I also noticed that used your administrative tools to unprotect (reduce the protection) on the ''Cyrus the Great'' article, and then (3 minutes later) re-wrote it to reflect your pov, totally changing the tone of the article,[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cyrus_the_Great&diff=241322135&oldid=241321806] without a by-your-leave on the [[Talk:Cyrus the Great|talk page]]. You appear to be instigating edit-wars on anything related to Cyrus: ''Cyrus the Great,'' ''The Cyrus Cylinder,'' ''The [[Battle of Opis]],'' ''[[Kaveh Farrokh]]'' and possibly more that I am not aware of. This does not seem right to me. Is there something I'm missing? [[User:Tundrabuggy|Tundrabuggy]] ([[User talk:Tundrabuggy|talk]]) 05:14, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:You really do interpret everything as a conspiracy, don't you? Your stalkerish behaviour - following me around to articles that you've never edited before and injecting yourself into any editing disputes in which I'm involved - is the kind of thing that could get you into a [[WP:STALK|a lot of trouble]]; please desist. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 09:58, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:Also, whatever happened to the sentiments you expressed above at [[#Re:Civility Warning]]? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 11:22, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

::Re: wikistalking, I will just add that I was invited to contribute at Cyrus Cylinder by another editor, and that it falls within my area of (editing) interests. re: "injecting myself into any editing disputes in which you are involved" -- I don't think so. As I pointed out , all the articles above are intimately related to each other, and thus to be involved in one is to be involved in them all. [[User:Tundrabuggy|Tundrabuggy]] ([[User talk:Tundrabuggy|talk]]) 17:04, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:::Who invited you, and why? What particular experience or expertise do you have in this area that would make you particularly suitable to "review" ChrisO's contribitions? If memory serves, you have frequently been on the opposite sides of disputes with ChrisO. It would probably be a good idea for you to leave any "reviews" to neutral editors who have experience in the subject area. What you are doing here, Tundrabuggy, strikes me as [[WP:CIVIL|uncivil]] behavior, designed to upset ChrisO, with little apparent benefit to the project. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] <sup>[[User talk:Jehochman|Talk]]</sup> 20:36, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

::::The remarks are unacceptable. They give a strong impression that you, [[User:Tundrabuggy|Tundrabuggy]], have assumed administrative functions of oversight and monitoring 'problematical' editors. To put it mildly, this was immensely crass.[[User:Nishidani|Nishidani]] ([[User talk:Nishidani|talk]]) 20:48, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::Nishidani, please do not use an argument that you are not involved in to assault another editor with offensive suggestions. I would propose you give a look at [[WP:OMGcom]] and make note that you are not registered as a member.
:::::p.s. to put it mildly, [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3AEleland&diff=242315100&oldid=242312758 this comment] was crass like a herculean mammoth making origami with used toilet paper. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 21:44, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
:::::::Dearie me, [[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]! You've had me tossing and turning all night over whether 'herculean mammoth' constitutes a pleonasm or a rhetorical tautology. The anachronism is okay, but the image does not justify 'crass'. A mammoth of any proportion delicately folding washi bumf into ply is at best spectacularly Disneyesque, and would be as much a feature in Jurassic Park for the gasps of tender admiration it would conjure up as a panda in LA. Still, it's a charmer of an image. Céline's Spanish proverb came to mind instantly: ''beaucoup de vaseline, encore plus de patience, Eléphant encugule fourmi''. I've overstayed my welcome. Cheers.[[User:Nishidani|Nishidani]] ([[User talk:Nishidani|talk]]) 15:34, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::Tundrabuggy, I'm not sure as to the issues but I've already suggested to you to take a step back and note me with concerns so that we can find a way to resolve the current tensions between you and ChrisO. I'm a bit unhappy to see that you two cannot break down this tension built from the Muhammad al-Durrah article and that it's being transferred to other articles as well. May I suggest that the two of you take an agreed upon break from the 1-2 articles that the two of you are working on and that you will return to editing them after reviewing [[WP:NAM]] and without bad faith? <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 21:49, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

::::::I think the root of the problem here is that Tundrabuggy is seeing everything through the filter of his views on the Arab-Israeli conflict. See his comments at [[#Re:Civility Warning]] above, where he accuses me of presenting a "pro-Palestinian nationalist perspective" on ancient Persian history. I have no idea what such a perspective would look like, where you would find it or even if it exists. My own involvement in these articles came about simply because Dbachmann posted a request for input on the fringe theories noticeboard a month ago (see [[Wikipedia:Fringe theories/Noticeboard/Archive 8#Cyrus cylinder]]). Tundrabuggy seems to have decided that it's his mission to combat anything he sees as "pro-Palestinian nationalism" being added by myself, even if it's nothing of the sort. As for taking a break, might I point out that Tundrabuggy has now followed me to three separate articles and two noticeboards where I've posted queries, and is now posting accusing messages to my talk page without provocation? It's that behaviour that needs to stop. Taking a break from articles won't address that issue. It's stalking, pure and simple. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 23:13, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::::I'm aware of the stalking concerns but I was hoping that a pause on (A) the raising of these concerns, and (B) a pause on these articles - could give a bit of time to Tundra and everyone else involved to reflect. If he chooses to follow you to yet more articles after an agreed upon pause, then it's a sign that he is not listening - if he will listen, then we might be doing better. I know it's a bit of a difficult suggestion to accept when you start editing an article with the other guy uninvolved on it, but I've been pushed into this type of retraction activity myself in the past few months, oddly enough, by several of the people mentioned on the new JIDF page (saw that thing last night - pointless and inappropriate IMHO). Think about my suggestion a bit more - '''Tundra''', it might be helpful if you stretch out an olive branch and make note that you agree to my suggestion. I can assure you that no special damage would occur if both of you stop editing an article or two for a little while and if major concerns arise during this time, I'd be happy to hear the concerns and try and find a common (and less hostile) ground for discourse. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 06:31, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
::::::::Can I just add that this accusation of Tundrabuggy's is wrong: "you turn to the award he received, and attempted to delete the awarding organisation" if it is supposed to mean he started the AfD. And as for his claim about the RNS challenge of a website, if the website is Savepasargad.com, as I assume it is, the only editor besides ChrisO and Tundrabuggy in that section is an uninvolved editor who (rightly, in my opinin) agreed with ChrisO. Not 'others', and the panning was just pointing out correctly that Farrokh has no academic qualifications as a historian. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 14:23, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
:::::::::If you mean the AfD you're thinking of, Doug, actually ''you'' started that one, not me! [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/The_World_Academy_of_Arts,_Literature,_and_Media] Tundrabuggy seems to have seen my endorsement of it and thought I was the one who started it. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 14:31, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::Sorry, that's what I meant. I started it. [[User:Dougweller|Doug Weller]] ([[User talk:Dougweller|talk]]) 14:52, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::I'm thinking both sides of this argument believe in their righteousness and that certainly at least one of them is wrong to some extent (keeping it a neutral statement here). What bothers me is that the focus is on minor digs rather than the content and therefore I made my suggestion that they try and take a bit of a break from each other. I will note that I believe Tundra should take the first step, and that ChrisO should be the one to respond in a collaborative spirit to the good-will gesture. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 14:33, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

:Just a note to let everyone know that I will continue editing anything to do with the Cyrus articles in an attempt to help insure that they are good encyclopedic articles reflecting historical integrity. That is my only goal here on wiki in any of the articles that I edit. Have a great day! [[User:Tundrabuggy|Tundrabuggy]] ([[User talk:Tundrabuggy|talk]]) 19:04, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

::In that case, I suggest you two work with [[WP:DR]], specifically, [[WP:3O]] and [[WP:RfC]]. I think you're making a mistake insisting on not taking a mutual break along with ChrisO from the article. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 20:42, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

:::It's a pity that Tundrabuggy is insisting on [[WP:BATTLE|treating Wikipedia as a battlefield]]. It's the kind of thing that gets editors blocked. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 20:51, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

::::Well, it certainly has gotten ''you'' blocked, Chris -- and not nearly as often as it would have if all editors were treated equally around here. [[User:6SJ7|6SJ7]] ([[User talk:6SJ7|talk]]) 06:16, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::Let's just note that I'm not the one following people around from article to article, pursuing some sort of ideological battle. Speaking of which, what are ''you'' doing here? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 07:36, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

::::::I'm thinking, the same thing Nishidani was. Gotta love the [[Mary J. Blige|drama]]. <b><font face="Arial" color="teal">[[User:Jaakobou|Jaakobou]]</font><font color="1F860E"><sup>''[[User talk:Jaakobou|Chalk Talk]]''</sup></font></b> 07:53, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

== Edit war? ==
The most common measure of edit warring is the confrontation to affect content disputes, and by that measure it would be strange to call my single edit in the whole history of that page an "Edit war" . Anyway , first I saw that a sourced material was deleted: If a dispute on reliabilty of source is on-going , I would have no objection in omission of that source. --[[User:Alborz Fallah|Alborz Fallah]] ([[User talk:Alborz Fallah|talk]]) 22:00, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

:Since multiple editors are involved in repeatedly adding and reverting that source, there's clearly an edit war. My purpose in asking you not to revert again was simply to direct you to the discussion on that source - you're welcome to contribute to it, if you wish. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 23:15, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

== The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXXI (September 2008) ==
The '''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Outreach/Newsletter September 2008|September 2008 issue]]''' of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.<br /><small>This has been an automated delivery by [[User:BrownBot|BrownBot]] ([[User talk:BrownBot|talk]]) 22:09, 6 October 2008 (UTC)</small>
==Ok==
But your description is not neutral. We need a description of the problem without tags and labels. It would be better if it is minimal and then we can give the actual arguments in the meidation. --[[User:Nepaheshgar|Nepaheshgar]] ([[User talk:Nepaheshgar|talk]]) 22:53, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

:Please leave the detailed arguments until the mediation. I've trimmed the text to see if we can compromise on this - what do you think of it now? -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO#top|talk]]) 22:56, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
::Okay I commented on the talkpage of the dispute. --[[User:Nepaheshgar|Nepaheshgar]] ([[User talk:Nepaheshgar|talk]]) 23:34, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
::I might comment more in the talkpage. For example the dispute is about a single line not the whole chronicle. Also we should seek someone that is either knowledegable or has access to an academic that knows Akkadian. --[[User:Nepaheshgar|Nepaheshgar]] ([[User talk:Nepaheshgar|talk]]) 23:39, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

Chris, thanks for placing the mediation request; I'll be happy to participate. [[User:Akhilleus|--Akhilleus]] ([[User talk:Akhilleus|talk]]) 00:57, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

==A note==
Hi ChrisO, I was just wondering if you are going to include LarnoMan (who started this whole thing, because when I was creating the Battle of Opis article, he removed Grayson's translation that I had put there from the www.livius.org. And which this whole dispute began as he tried to convince me that Grayson's translation was wrong, which currently I do not know who is right.) and if you are going to include CreazySuit, just tell me, because I have not heard anything from them from a long time. It is like they dissappeared into the Twilight Zone, so if you could please message me back, thanks from Ario.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 01:12, 7 October 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

:Um, ChrisO if you look at the recent messages of the mediation page at the very bottom, even Farrokh as thought of the possibility that when Nabu's army was defeated, and I remember reading this from an ancient historian which says Nabu and a few others that were still loyal to him hid themselves in Sippar (not sure if this is the name of the city), were they were almost besieged by Cyrus, but considering that the city was small (research this if you do not believe me), and Nabu's army had to be generally bigger, because they would have trouble fitting in the building. It appears (and this was said by Kaveh, but others thought Kaveh was saying that no massacre happened, where as he actually said it was not selective of the citizens, but the army was massacred) therefore because the majority of Nabu's army was stranded outside, it seems Cyrus with is larger army may have actually slaughtered the army of Opis.

Do not worry I wil represent were I got this saying, from an ancient historian which the name now escapes me, and various other academics on the subject. I will definitly reference every sentence in the aftermath (when I include it there). So I was just wondering if you ever heard of the outcome where Cyrus slaughtered (as most translations say he and or Nabu slaughtered but do not know '''who''' he slaughtered) the army of Opis, also go on the talk page of Opis were I put that qoute from Kaveh, YES Kaveh thinks there was a slaughter by maybe Cyrus, and Kaveh thinks it was the army that was slaughtered, so please respond to my message(I am not saying Kaveh is the only one saying this and he is right, I am saying this notion is becoming popular, and others are saying the same thing too) I do not know why I have trouble getting feedback from you, I just want us to have a better dialoge with eachother, thanks anyways , with best regards.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 07:54, 8 October 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

==ChrisO please read this, and tell me what is wrong==
Hi ChrisO, something conernes me, I think (based on your own neutrality rules) you should stop saying ''but he shows his take over of Babylon was peacefull, but his battle was not peacefull, therefore the Cyrus Cylinder is propaganda.'' Have you ever read the Cyrus Cylinder itself? It is clearly talking a decree to the citizens of the '''city''' of Babylon (the capital, because the empire at the time was called the Chaldaean or Neo-Babylonian Empire), it says his take over was peacefull, and that is TRUE, because he never ''besieged'' Babylon. According to all mushed up accounts, Gubaru diverted its river, and his troops when the water was at hips height entered the city at night, then Cyrus joined later, and then a few guards and ''maybe'' the son of Nabonidus was killed with a candle holder by Gadates and or Gubaru (I KNOW the story from all versions). If his decree was to all Babylonia, then it would make sense it was propaganda because he had fought a battle before, '''BUT''' when he is speaking to the Jews of Babylon, which he is on the tablet, then of course he is speaking to the '''city''' of Babylon were ''all'' the Jews were! Not ''all'' of Babylonia, yet you keep saying he captured Babylon in great bloody battle, when only a couple of guards ''might'' have been killed during the night raid. Thanks.

Here is what is wrong with ChrisO's neutral point of view, by referencing this it seems unlikely that this is neutrality;

"After the Babylonian defeat at Opis, both Sippar and Babylon surrendered, opening the gates of their cities to the enemy. In doing so, the people of Sippar and Babylon had made a choice between accepting a new ruler or being killed and having their city destroyed. The chronicle clearly depicts Cyrus as a ruthless military conqueror, a portrait which stands in sharp contrast to the image of the benign ruler related by himself [in the Cyrus cylinder], and presented in the books of the Old Testament."

1. Now here is the problem, Sippar had no choice because it was running out of supplies, and it was Nabonidus plan to shut himself in the city for some strategic plan he had in mind, but it never worked out (I will cite this if you do not believe me).

2. Babylon did not surrender and open their gates, (EVEN if they thought the Persians were going to destroy everything) the Persians got in '''themselves''', what Kuhrt (I THINK it is a she) says is theoritical commentary, just some extra blah blah to expand her book a little more, it completely contradicts the all the accounts, as you may have read above (actually it might be in talkOpis or talkChrisO) how Babylon was taken, so I will not repeat myself. And I am not saying she did this on purpose, it is possible she did not know. Now history tells us that after the Persians captured Babylon themselves, (and here is the question) did the Persains kill the inhabitants and destroy the city? THIS is what Kuhrt tells us, ''In doing so, the people of Sippar and Babylon had made a choice between accepting a new ruler or being killed and having their city destroyed.'' Will according to all accepted history the Persians '''did not''' destroy or kill anyone in the city of Babylon (which is the capital), they did the opposite. THE GREAT MYSTERY to me is why does ChrisO keep referencing uneutral, biased, somewhat Greek nationalistic, and out of date with a touch of denial in history SOURCES? Sounds like a good recipe huh? ChrisO I got gut feeling that tells me you ''might'' not be neutral, NoW Am I WoRnG?--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 22:47, 8 October 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

:One thing that you should never forget, it may seem that me (I barely do it though) and others might want to make the Persians look amazing, it is because of ITS HISTORY, we make our points on that, and even if you read Persian history, I think that EVEN you yourself will start talking in a nationalistic tone about Persia. So my point is that I think that you might not know about Persian history that much, therefore you theorise that just because we seem to talk good about Persia we are nationalistic. But what is unfair is that means that all the major historians WHO talk good about Greece are nationalistic too? Generally most historians tend to like Greece more than Persia, because they think the Greeks are the backbone of the Western world, and the IRONY here is that even the Greeks themselves say they got most of their knowledge from the Babylonians, Egyptians, ''Atlantians'', as other historians have also confirmed this whether or not Greeks say it. So up to this time I can assure you that overall this whole problem on Wikipedia, as also do not think that I believe Iranian nationalists ''dont'' exist, I believe Iranian nationalist are out there. But we must analyze; WHY there are IN (short for Iranian Nationalists)? And me knowing much about the problem CAN answer that question. IT is because Persians now feel because of tensions between the west and east, 300, Iranian nuclear program, Iranians think the WEST is trying to kill their culture. ((Now just to know, I am not debating or argueing with you in this paragraph, I am saying what I think the problem is here with facts.)) (AS AN EXAMPLE) Imagine if your Jewish, and Hollywood makes an Anti-semitic flick, US invades Syria, and put sanctions on Israel. Than I can assure you will be VERY defending of your culture, and then Ariobarza calls you a nationalist. So, do you see what I mean, you must analyze why these things are happening in the FIRST place, before telling me and others that we are IN and unbalanced, I am a Libra by the way, and I am balanced. I just hope as a human you can be understanding toward this problem, and NOT make assumptions. Thanks for reading.--[[User:Ariobarza|Ariobarza]] ([[User talk:Ariobarza|talk]]) 08:34, 11 October 2008 (UTC)Ariobarza talk

== Request assistance [[Macedonian]] article ==

i wanted to organize the information on the [[Macedonian]] article, and have encountered some pretty strong and (according to me) unresonable resistance. In few words the point is the that by Macedonian we primary (or mainly) refer to a citizen of [[Republic of Macedonia]], a person with Macedonian Nationality or a member of [[Macedonians (ethnic group)]], just secondly with Macedonian we describe a broader, mainly undocumented, unofficial Macedonian Regional Identity. Can you objectively assist, thank you [[User:Alex Makedon|Alex Makedon]] ([[User talk:Alex Makedon|talk]]) 07:31, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
Can you take a look plz, its the second time i make an argumented constructive modification of the article, according to agreements and suggestions discussed on the talk page, that are reverted with no other reasons stated than "there is no consensus" (in other words i dont like your edit). [[User:Alex Makedon|Alex Makedon]] ([[User talk:Alex Makedon|talk]]) 11:03, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Revision as of 08:34, 11 October 2008

Ars Technica
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Ars Technica (Template:PronEng, Latin for "Art of Technology")[1] is a technology-related website that caters to PC enthusiasts, covering technology, science, and gaming news along with editorial comment and analysis. Started in 1998 by Ken "Caesar" Fisher, Ars Technica is headquartered in Malden, Massachusetts.[2] The site was independently owned until it was acquired by Condé Nast Publications in May 2008.[3]

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  4. ^ IP Democracy
  5. ^ duncanriley.com » Does Ars Technica rip every story without credit?
  6. ^ ParisLemon: Another Classic Rip-Off Job By Ars Technica
  7. ^ Forums Rankings - all software forums, all languages language, website ranking by posts
  8. ^ Insane Dell Inspiron coupon deal (US$750 off US$1499), take two
  9. ^ Ars Technica - Federated Media Publishing
  10. ^ "Ars Technica acquired by Condé Nast: the low-down". Ars Technica. 2008-05-19. Retrieved 2008-05-20.
  11. ^ "Breaking: Condé Nast/Wired Acquires Ars Technica". TechCrunch. 2008-05-16. Retrieved 2008-05-16.

External links

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