Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Singapore

Welcome to the talkpage of the SGpedians' notice board, where you can discuss about Singapore-related articles and issues. Enjoy! =)

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Singaporean Awards and Decorations

I have spent a bit of time updating the Singaporean orders and decorations and Awards and decorations of the Singapore Armed Forces pages, as well as the link pages for each individual medal. However - it has proven a very difficult thing to verify accurately, and I suspect that I may have some errors of fact in the order of precedence for the medals, and I may possibly be missing some as well. If possible, could someone please run their eye over the list, and let me know if it looks accurate?

I should point out that one reason I have had some difficulty is that the Government of Singapore seems very reluctant to give a full list of what awards and decorations they issue! For example, the PM's Office lists the civilian awards, but does not go into a huge amount of detail for them, nor does it mention how they relate to the military list. The Singapore Army medal info page only lists the medals for service, with no mention of the medals for gallantry. If anyone can cite an authoritative list, that would be great... failing that, is there an defence manual/publication that could be used as a reference?

Thanks! PalawanOz 06:18, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

G'day mate! i attended the Singapore Honours, an exhibition honouring S'pore distinguised citizens upon my return from Sydney last year. It was held From Jun 22 - Aug 2006 at our National Library. The event also showcased the process of making the above medals & its criteria for award officially. Do check out & direct your enquiries here -- Aldwinteo 07:04, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Chia Thye Poh

Hi folks, can those on 'guard's duty', kindly cast their patrol wider to cover the abv article and other similar articles on past SG political detainees to thwart any potential vandalism & POV. Cos some human rights 'crusaders' have made substantial edits of late & making disparaging remarks on Chia, S'pore govt & Singaporeans on the article's talkpage. u may want to take a good look on the pix he use to depict Chia's detention on Sentosa. Thks & rgds, -- Aldwinteo 14:59, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

The protection policy states that "indefinite semi-protection may be used for...biographies subject to vandalism and/or POV-pushing that are not widely watchlisted". I believe that Chia Thye Poh falls under this criterion, and suggest you file a request for semi-protection. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:02, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

I Not Stupid and Singapore Dreaming passed GA - let's keep up the good work!

WikiProject Singapore appears to be flourishing; in the past three weeks, we have written 14 DYKs and 2 GAs (of these, I Not Stupid and Megan Zheng were written by me)! When listing Megan Zheng as a DYK, Blnguyen commented: "Very hard wroking [sic] these Singaporeans".

Let's keep up the good work! I believe we can increase our GA count from 8 to 10 by 9 September (when I will take a two-month wikibreak to focus on my O Levels). I have identified Singapore (a former GA), Singapore 2006 (which failed GA on 18 January 2007) and The Singapore Stone (which passed DYK on 22 July 2007) as articles with GA potential. When can we launch the GA drive and collaborate to improve these articles to GA status?

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 16:09, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I'll also be adopting an article for the GA drive, but I haven't decided which. That'll be in late October. - SpLoT // 16:14, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I recently expanded "The Singapore Stone" from a stub. I'll be back in Singapore for a month from 12 August 2007. If I have time, I might pop down to the National Library and look up some books for information to tidy up the article. Cheers, Jacklee 17:00, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your interest in the GA drive, SpLoT. During the rest of August, I will improve an article (probably I Not Stupid Too and, if she ever sends me the newspaper/magazine articles she promised, Xiaxue) and nominate it for the GA drive. Hopefully you (and I, after the O Levels are over and I return to Wikipedia on 12 November 2007) will have more articles to choose from then. (I can spot some potential in Bonny Hicks, and Huaiwei may wish to check what could prevent Law in Singapore from attaining GA status.)

Jacklee, do you think The Singapore Stone is "broad in its coverage" (GA criterion 3)? If so, it's time to check for prose, reference and stylistic issues. If not, which aspects of the stone lack coverage?

I have filed peer reviews for all three articles. Your comments are welcome at Peer review/Singapore, Peer review/Singapore 2006 and Peer review/The Singapore Stone. If others mention any problems, we should do our best to address them.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:59, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Jacklee, it's been a week since you returned to the Lion City. How is your research going? As I previously said, if you believe the article is already "broad in its coverage", it's time to check the prose, references and style. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 03:12, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, yes, I'm back in Singapore but haven't had a chance to go to the National Library yet to look up material for "The Singapore Stone". I'm not sure how "broad in its coverage" should be interpreted in respect of this article: the article is about an artefact that is particular to Singapore archaeology, so its ambit is bound to be fairly narrow. However, when I'm down at the Library I will see if there are any sources situating the Singapore Stone in the context of Southeast Asian archaeology. As for "Law of Singapore", which I also rewrote extensively, I don't think it's ready for a GA nomination. It's too heavily skewed towards the history of the legal system at the moment, and probably needs more information on contemporary law. See the discussion on the talk page of that article. Cheers, Jacklee 06:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Actually, one article that might be worth trying to get to GA status is "Sources of Singapore law". I wrote it as part of "Law of Singapore" but I later converted it into a separate article because the "Law of Singapore" was getting too long. However, before it is nominated I think the introductory paragraph needs to be expanded and the links removed from the bold text. Cheers, Jacklee 09:27, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Welcome back to our sunny island. As a suggestion here, do make a visit to Lee Kong Chian Reference Library's "Singapore and Southeast Asian Collections" (Level 11) at Victoria St. This reference library is where I always go for my research for my writeups & mtg up with fellow history buffs & Research Fellows. It has an extensive collection (over 200,000) of out-of-print bks, resource materials & latest bks too. Kindly note that there's a security check b4 entry & u r required to deposit yr bag (except yr notes & stationery) at the lockers (FOC). Also, bring along a cashcard as it will be needed to pay for photocopying & other transactions. Do approach the Reference Librarians shld u required assistance there. Lastly, a site-visit (helpful in my previous writings too) to view the Stone may inspire u or provide useful leads during its guided tours too -- Aldwinteo 10:19, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

History of...

Hi, all! WP:LGBT just found History of homosexuality in Singapore (2000s) and tagged it with {{newsrelease}}. We don't really have much experience or knowledge around the content of the article, though, so if anyone from this group can give us a hand, it would be much appreciated! Thanks :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:30, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

who are the veterans and best article writers here?

Deletion review for List of hotels in Singapore

I have started a deletion review for List of hotels in Singapore at the administrator's talkpage. His deletion rationale, particularly "Just because the article is about Singapore does not make it article-worthy"[1] (he has since removed that rationale thou) dosent appear particularly professionale given the discussions which took place make hardly any mention on keeping the article based on nothing but its association with Singapore.--Huaiwei 02:40, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Update: the above article's has been temporarily "stored" at User:Huaiwei/Cold Storage/List of hotels in Singapore‎ while I consider ways to resurrect the list in a way which ensures it fits within the criteria in Wikipedia:Lists. All are welcome to contribute ideas for the new list. Thanks!--Huaiwei 03:46, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Category cleanup of Secondary schools in Singapore

I have just embarked on a cleanup of articles in the category Secondary_schools_in_Singapore. I notices the common problem is that many have huge long lists of courses or CCA's offered, which I do not believe are very necessary nor encyclopaedic. I have deleted these lists withou touching any prose which is related to CCA.

There has also been the tendency of editors to include items such as school's philosophy, mission statements, vision statements and strategic goals. I believe these to be highly promotional texts. In most cases, they have also been removed. Ohconfucius 10:43, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

For articles on Singaporean schools to improve, we need:

• Guidelines on how such articles should be structured, what information should and should not be included, etc.
• SGpedians willing to contribute to such articles.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:50, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

• There are a number of school articles which have made it to GA or FA status, and these can be used as models. Ohconfucius 03:28, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Point me to some of them. Don't include universities in your examples - they're a different animal altogether. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 05:14, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

• Primary_schools_in_Singapore has also been cleaned up in the same manner. Ohconfucius 03:29, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

It's National Day!

Yes, the Lion City turns 42 today. Did you watch the National Day Parade? I did. I couldn't stop singing, because I'm from Singapore. (Get it?) Next year, we should try to get a DYK (or even an FA) on the main page on 9 August. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:17, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

w00t, The Majestic, Singapore is on DYK now, complete with a photo too. —Sengkang 15:05, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Cool! Anyone willing to try for a Singapore-related FA on the main page on 9 August 2008? May all Wikipedians hear the lion roar! --J.L.W.S. The Special One 05:11, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Er....how about Singapore itself? ;) Anyway happy belated birthday, Singapore. I couldnt post a greeting earlier as I was there to protect you. :D--Huaiwei 05:43, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Singapore lost its GA status last month, and is one of three articles I nominated for the most recent proposed GA drive. Once the article passes GA, we can aim for FA status! --J.L.W.S. The Special One 15:16, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Project SuperStar, Campus SuperStar

Project SuperStar and Campus SuperStar are too long. Too much information are thrown into the articles, making them sound much like a news release. The scores of every stages are unnecessary and should be taken out. Remember, Wikipedia is not a manual, guidebook, or textbook. See also Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not. Cocoma 22:42, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

• American Idol looks pretty long too, so just what exactly is the trend here when dealing with television shows of similar genre? Split them into multiple articles per season?--Huaiwei 02:21, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

• Probably organizing the information in a more tidy way would makes the articles better as shown on American Idol. Current score keeping makes the articles fairly long and cluttered. Cocoma 15:43, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Suspected copyright violation

The article The Fullerton Singapore has been listed as copyright violation. See Talk:The Fullerton Singapore. Can anyone by any chance confirm this? Garion96 (talk) 21:13, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

As I was at LKC Reference Lib doing my research & compiling for my upcoming series of WWII writeups recently, I decided to help in checking out the copyvio mentioned by Reaperducer on July 27, 2007. My cross-checking shows that under "The Fullerton Building" section, from para 1 to para 7 (till "In the 1970s to 1995...), the text is a direct lifting of word for word from "S'pore 100 Historic Places" (2002) by NHB, Archipelago Press. As the Fullerton is both a heritage site and a national monument in S'pore, I hope fellow SGpedians wld chip in to rewrite the affected para so as to resolve on this issue quickly. FYI & rgds -- Aldwinteo 04:19, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I deleted the article and created a stub. I hope it can be a good article again soon. Garion96 (talk) 18:00, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Issue resolved. —Sengkang 02:22, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Majulah Singapura

I was wondering if I can see if any of yall could try and take photographs for this article. BTW, if the article feels short, check the history of the article before trying to smash my head open. User:Zscout370 ^{(Return Fire)} 07:06, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

New template: Malay name

While expanding "Zubir Said", I created a new template, "{{Malay name}}" to explain that Malay names do not have have any surname. Feel free to use or improve it. A separate variation might be needed to explain the significance of bin (b.) and binte (bte.). And while we're at it, perhaps a template is needed for Indian names too! Cheers, Jacklee 06:03, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

I've also created "{{Malay name2}}" which explains the meaning of bin (b.) and binte (bte.). Cheers, Jacklee 18:11, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Starting the GA drive

Nobody has objected to my idea of a GA drive, which I previously raised two times. In fact, this suggestion has received considerable support - for example, Chensiyuan commented: "Not a bad proposal". Several SGpedians have expressed interest in adopting articles: Huaiwei commented: "I wish I have the time to "adopt" the Singapore 2006 article", while SpLoT commented: "I'll also be adopting an article for the GA drive".

Therefore, I think it is time to get the ball rolling. If nobody objects within the next 72 hours, I will be bold and add a "GA drive" section to the SGpedians' notice board project page. Feel free to ask any questions about the GA drive, or suggest how the section should be formatted. For now, I'll use a simple format (two examples are shown below):

1. I Not Stupid Too: The Plot section needs to be summarised and the Reception section expanded, after which the article should be copy-edited and checked for MoS violations.

   adopted by Hildanknight

2. Singapore 2006: The article's coverage of several areas, particularly logistics, is weak. Several sections lack references, and a copy-edit is needed.

   adopted by Huaiwei

Once I add the section, the GA drive will start - albeit in an experimental stage. We will obviously need a critical mass of skilled SGpedian article writers to participate in the GA drive, if the experiment is to succeed.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 16:20, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

No objections? I've added the section. It will take me a couple of hours to flesh it out, though. Feel free to improve the wording. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 01:21, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Wah I dio arrow liao ah! :D Erm will try to look into this soon, but please dont rush it into a GA yet shall we? I would rather we submit a polished piece then a rushed one. Thanks!--Huaiwei 07:47, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Relax, Huaiwei. Only after at least three SGpedians adopt Singapore 2006 will the collaboration start. If you have "met [your] major deadlines at work", do adopt the article, and encourage others to. I agree that we should only submit a GA nomination when the article is the best it can be. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:44, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Singapore as a regional and global hub

Cleanup & references needed. I've tried to salvage as much as I can out of this piece of drivel. Anyone care to help? Or should we just send it to AfD?--Rifleman 82 03:34, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

After reading the article once, I reckon there is nothing in it that can't be mentioned in Singapore or a sub-article thereof. Should be worth a redirect. Resurgent insurgent 14:37, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

As far as I can see, it is an orphan. Why not speedy it and forget about it? --Rifleman 82 14:55, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't meet the speedy criteria. And plausibly anyone who's been given this phrase as an essay title might type it into the search box, where they would be redirected to a good starting point. (If you look at the first version of the page, it was created as a school essay too.) Resurgent insurgent 00:38, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Arthur Ernest Percival - an FA - not listed in "Featured articles and honourable mentions"

Under "SGpedians' Resources", I noticed an FA - Arthur Ernest Percival - that was not listed in "Featured articles and other honourable mentions". Per the precedent set by Tropical Storm Vamei, all articles pertaining to Singapore are within our scope, and all FAs, GAs or DYKs within our scope should be listed in "Featured articles or other honourable mentions". Could an SGpedian add Arthur Ernest Percival to "Featured articles and other honourable mentions"? The article passed FAC on 22 February 2006 and appeared on the Main Page on 2 January 2007. If there is a reason for not listing Arthur Ernest Percival under "Featured articles and other honourable mentions", I would like to hear/read it. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 02:42, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Durian, an FA, is listed as being under our scope. How is the article within our scope? Although the fruit can be found in the Lion City, it is hardly part of Singaporean cuisine, unlike Hainanese chicken rice or roti prata. If the article really is within our scope, it should be listed in "Featured articles and honourable mentions". --J.L.W.S. The Special One 07:20, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

Reliable sources about football in Singapore?

During my 18+ months as a Wikipedian, I have primarily focused on contributing to articles about Jack Neo movies. Having written a GA (I Not Stupid) and 3 DYKs (Money No Enough, The Best Bet and Megan Zheng), I believe I have succeeded in improving Wikipedia's coverage of Jack Neo movies. However, in the long run, I will need to expand my horizons, and write about other Singapore-related topics.

I have an interest in local football (Tampines Rovers rocks!) and desire to know more about Singaporean football clubs and football players. Researching to write (or contribute to existing) Wikipedia articles pertaining to football in Singapore would be a great way to do so.

For any article pertaining to local football - be it about the national team, a professional football competition, football club or football player - to attain GA status (or even DYK), it must be well-referenced. Unfortunately, reliable sources about football are few and far between. In this section, could we compile a list of reliable sources about football in Singapore? Anyone - not just me - who wishes to contribute to articles about football in Singapore would find such a list very useful.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 12:31, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

S.League clubs

I read 5 articles on English Premier League football clubs - Arsenal F.C., Aston Villa F.C., Chelsea F.C., Everton F.C. and Manchester City F.C. - and reviewed the sources used to reference them. After doing so, I have a general idea of how to structure articles on S.League clubs. My analysis is outlined below. I believe that for an article on an S.League club to meet the "broad coverage" section of the GA criteria, it must have the first three sections and at least two* of the remaining four sections:

1. History sections of EPL club articles are usually sourced to the club's official website and books about the club's history. Newspaper articles are also occasionally used as references. Has anybody published a book about the history of any S.League club? (In my opinion, 3-6 paragraphs is the optimal length for History sections on articles on S.League clubs.)
2. Sections listing the players (and management staff) are, almost without exception, sourced to the club's official website.
3. Similarly, S.League record sections (which should also list continential competition and Singapore Cup wins, if applicable) can safely be sourced to the club's and competition's official website (although newspaper articles may sometimes be useful).
4. In EPL club articles, the Reserve/youth/ladies teams sections are usually written in summary style, with links to...unreferenced main articles. I'm not sure what sources should be used for such articles.
5. For Crest and colours sections of EPL club articles, a wide variety of sources are used, including official sites, newspaper articles, reputable fansites and sites dedicated to football kits.
6. References for Stadium sections tend to be sparse but varied. Official websites, newspaper articles and reputable fansites featire prominently, though.
7. Finally, Supporters sections primarily rely links on polls, records and statistics, as well as newspaper and magazine articles, as sources. Official sites and other sites are used to a lesser extent.

*Sections should have at least one coherently-written paragraph of no less than three sentences.

Based on my analysis, the most important sources are official sites and newspaper articles. Furthermore, whether an S.League club article has a reasonable chance of achieving GA status largely depends on whether somebody has published a book about the club and its history. The first S.League club article I want to push to GA status would be Tampines Rovers, which I have supported since I was 12 (their stadium is a stone's throw away from my school). Tampines are among the oldest and most successful clubs in the S.League; I believe there would be more information about them than, for example, Woodlands Wellington or Balestier Khalsa.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 04:56, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Kudos for the research you've done so far. If any books on S-League clubs have been written, copies should have been deposited with the National Library – check the NLB's online catalogue. As for the rest of the information, you'll probably have to rely on the on-line (or, more likely, the print) versions of local newspapers – possibly more trips to the library for you. Don't The New Paper and Today tend to publish more news on S-League clubs? Also, is there a magazine dedicated to local football? All the best for your endeavours. Cheers, Jacklee 11:53, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

I searched the online catalogue for "S.League" and the names of several clubs. All searches returned between 1 and 6 results, suggesting that there are several books available, all of which are worth their weight in gold (for someone researching about the S.League). Perhaps we could go to the LKC Reference Library during our next meetup?

As for newspaper articles, I hope somebody with access to a searchable newspaper archive - such as Newslink, Factiva or LexisNexis - could help me by searching the archive for "S.League", "Tampines Rovers", etc. and e-mailing me all newspaper articles that show up in the results.

My search for magazines (and reliable websites) dedicated to local football continues. If you find any, please post them here.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 08:40, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Just a few minor updates:

• Two Wikipedians, one with access to LexisNexis and one with access to Factiva, helped me search the archives for "Tampines Rovers". There were over 200 results in LexisNexis, and over 500 in Factiva, suggesting that there is plenty of newspaper coverage on local football - far exceeding my expectations. Once my O Levels are over, I will ask them to e-mail me the full text of all the newspaper articles.
• In Tampines Regional Library, I found a book entitled "S.League: the kick-off", which has some useful information about the S.League. How do I format citations where the source/reference is a book?
• I have joined several online communities dedicated to local football, such as kallangroar.com and sgfootball.com, under the username "whitekings". They may be able to help me find reliable sources about local football.
• --J.L.W.S. The Special One 06:44, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

On my birthday, 7 October, Mark e-mailed me several hundred newspaper articles about Tampines Rovers, which he found through Factiva, while I borrowed "S.League: the kick-off" from the library. In addition to information about the formation of the S.League, the book provides information on the S.League's eight founder clubs, five (Tampines Rovers, Geylang United, Woodlands Wellington and the two "armed forces" clubs) of which still play in the S.League. During my (limited, due to the upcoming O Levels) spare time, I will comb the book and newspaper articles for relevant information.

I believe I now have enough information to write a five-paragraph History section of Tampines Rovers F.C. Page 50 of "S.League: the kick-off" and the History section of the Stags' official website should provide enough information about the club's pre-S.League history, while I believe I can write two paragraphs about Tampines Rovers' S.League history based on their official website, the S.League's official website and newspaper articles.

Are any of you interested in local football? If you are, please consider collaborating with me on articles pertaining to football in Singapore. As the saying goes, many hands make light work. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 09:23, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

For citing books, see {{Cite book}}.--Rifleman 82 06:48, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

If you need help with the {{Cite book}} or {{Citation}} templates, get in touch with me. Cheers, Jacklee 16:53, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for providing a link to that template. Do I simply enclose it in <ref>...</ref> tags and fill the fields with whatever information I have? Would you consider the title, author, publisher, year and page number to be the most essential citation information? --J.L.W.S. The Special One 09:23, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes. You should also include any co-authors, the place of publication, and the ISBN of the book if it is known. (If ISBNs are not available from the National Library Board's online catalogue, try those of the NUS Libraries or British Library.) If the author has a first and last name, you should state them separately using the "last" and "first" parameters. Here are some examples:

Wikitext	Result
{{cite book|author=Palakrishnan|coauthors=Malathi Das|title=S. League : The Kick-Off|location=Singapore|publisher=[[S. League|Singapore Professional Football League]]|year=1996|pages=10–12}}	Palakrishnan (1996). S. League : The Kick-Off. Singapore: Singapore Professional Football League. pp. 10–12. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)
{{cite book|last=Koh|first=Tommy (ed.-in-chief)|title=Singapore : The Encyclopedia|location=Singapore|publisher=Editions Didier Millet|year=2006|isbn=9814155632 (hbk.)}}	Koh, Tommy (ed.-in-chief) (2006). Singapore : The Encyclopedia. Singapore: Editions Didier Millet. ISBN 9814155632 (hbk.). {{cite book}}: Check |isbn= value: invalid character (help)

If you're putting the citation in a footnote, then enclose it in <ref> and </ref> tags as you mentioned. If you're going to cite the same book several times, then the first time you can assign it a name using, for instance, "<ref name="S. League">". Subsequently, you can just refer to the same citation with "<ref name="S. League"/>" (note the forward slash after the reference name). Note that magazine articles should be cited using {{Citation}}, newspaper articles using {{Cite news}}, and websites using {{Cite web}}:

Wikitext	Result
{{citation|last=Ekstrand|first=J. [''et al.'']|title=Incidence of soccer injuries and their relation to training and team success|journal=American Journal of Sports Medicine|year=1983|volume=11|issue=1|pages=63–67|issn=0363-5465}}	Ekstrand, J. [et al.] (1983), "Incidence of soccer injuries and their relation to training and team success", American Journal of Sports Medicine, 11 (1): 63–67, ISSN 0363-5465
{{cite news|last=Winter|first=Henry|title=Michael Owen pushes pain barrier|url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2007/10/11/sfnowe111.xml|publisher=''[[The Daily Telegraph]]''|date=[[2007-10-11]]}}	Winter, Henry (2007-10-11). "Michael Owen pushes pain barrier". The Daily Telegraph. {{cite news}}: Check date values in: |date= (help); Italic or bold markup not allowed in: |publisher= (help)
{{cite web|title=Interview : Peter Crouch|url=http://www.fourfourtwo.premiumtv.co.uk/page/Interviews/0,,11442~1082853,00.html|publisher=''[[Four Four Two]]''|accessdate=2007-10-11}} (If the date of the article is available, use the "date" parameter too, like this: "date=[[2007-10-10]]".)	"Interview : Peter Crouch". Four Four Two. Retrieved 2007-10-11. {{cite web}}: Italic or bold markup not allowed in: |publisher= (help)

Cheers, Jacklee 12:15, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

GA review: "Sources of Singapore law"

I've Wikified and rewritten the introductory paragraphs of "Sources of Singapore law", and have nominated it for Good Article status. Cheers, Jacklee 22:21, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your efforts to improve Sources of Singapore law. I hope the article becomes our 10th GA! Perhaps you should have filed a peer review before nominating the article for GA status; if the nomination fails, do file one, and nominate the article for the GA drive.

You are also the primary contributor to The Singapore Stone, which you adopted when I nominated it for the GA drive. Once you expand the lead section and fix the MoS violations outlined in the article's archived peer review, the article should be ready for a GA nomination.

Keep up the good work! Due to my upcoming O Levels, I will be editing sporadically, but I hope to write another GA during the December holidays. Unfortunately, Xiaxue has not e-mailed me the newspaper/magazine articles she promised, so I will have to look for another article to work on (that's why I asked for reliable sources about football in Singapore).

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 07:24, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

The information required for "The Singapore Stone" is all there, but the article still needs tidying up and the introductory paragraphs need rewriting. Am a little busy at the moment; will get round to it soon. Sorry, can't help you regarding reliable sources about football. All the best for your O-levels! Cheers, Jacklee 08:24, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

I am pleased to announce that our GA tally has reached double figures after Fort Pasir Panjang and Sources of Singapore law recently passed GA. Congratulations, SGpedians, and keep up the good work! 6 articles (including Jacklee's The Singapore Stone) with GA potential have been nominated for the GA drive; could somebody adopt and contribute to them? As previously mentioned, I intend to write another GA - or two - during the December holidays. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 10:25, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

I have tidied up "Singapore Stone" (note the change of article title) and have nominated it for Good Article status. Cheers, Jacklee 01:45, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Singapore Statute template updated

I've updated the {{Singapore Statute}} template so that it is now possible to enter the short title ("name"), chapter number and year of the revised edition of a statute. This means that articles which make use of this template will need to be updated. Do help! Cheers, Jacklee 22:24, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

New template: Indian name

I've created a new template, "{{Indian name}}", which can be used at the top of biographical articles to explain that the subject does not have a surname, but that part of his or her name is a patronymic (that is, his or her father's name). Feel free to use and improve it.

As Indian names differ greatly, it may be necessary to create variations of this template – please leave a message on the template talk page if you have any suggestions. For instance, I've noticed that some people use "a/l" instead of "s/o" (son of). I assume that "a/l" means "son of" in Tamil, but don't know what it stands for or the equivalent of "daughter of". Also, someone will need to explain to me how Sikh names work. (Is "Kaur" or "Singh" regarded as a surname?) Cheers, Jacklee 09:13, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

I have another question: when an Indian name consists of a given name and a patronymic, is it always the case that the patronymic is put in front of the given name? In other words, if an Indian person's name is, say, "Shunmugam Jayakumar", would it be safe to assume that the person's given name is "Jayakumar" and that his father's name is "Shunmugam"? I'm wondering whether the order of the parameters in the template should be reversed. At the moment, it is necessary to type "{{Indian name|Jayakumar|Shunmugam}}". If the patronymic is always in front of the given name, perhaps it would be better to change the template so that it can be used like this: "{{Indian name|Shunmugam|Jayakumar}}", as this may be more natural for editors. Do discuss this matter further at "Template talk:Indian name#Order of parameters". Cheers, Jacklee 23:22, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Based on the discussion that has been taking place at "Template talk:Indian name#Order of parameters", it seems there is variation among Indians as to whether the patronymic is placed in front of or behind the given name (i.e., "Shanmugam Jayakumar" or "Jayakumar Shanmugam"). In that case, for the time being I'm going to leave the order of the parameters in {{Indian name}} unchanged. Editors using the template will need to be aware that they must state the person's given name as the first parameter and the patronymic as the second one, regardless of how they actually appear in the person's name. Cheers, Jacklee 13:58, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Please help the editing CHC article in chinese wiki

There are a lot of misleadings of CHC in chinese edition.

CHC in zh.wikipedia.org

Jyyihch 14:45, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Template:Singapore building infobox for deletion

Please note that the above template has been nominated by User:Circeus for deletion. See Wikipedia:Templates_for_deletion#Template:Singapore_building_infobox. —Sengkang 17:28, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

It's not so much a deletion as a merger (which would keep the extra names parameters) into an existing template. Circeus 17:45, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Zubir Said: Translation of Malay book titles

Can anyone help provide English translations of the following book and film titles which are referred to in the article "Zubir Said"?

• Sumpah Pontianak and Chuchu Datuk Merah (these appear in the "Move to Singapore" section).
• Dang Anom (appears in the "'Mahjulah Singapura'" section).
• Membacha Musik (appears in the "Works" section).
• Mengenang Pak Zubir (appears in the "Further reading" section).

Do you think this is an article that might achieve Good Article status?

Cheers, Jacklee 16:51, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Use of coat of arms of Singapore in templates

Hi, Mailer diablo recently applied Image:Singapore coa.png, an image of the Singapore coat of arms, to {{Politics of Singapore}} and {{Infobox Court Case}}. While I think that the coat of arms is attractive and suitable for these infoboxes, rule 3(1) of the Singapore Arms and Flag and National Anthem Rules (Cap. 296, R1, 2004 Rev. Ed.) states: "[N]o person shall, without the prior written permission of the Minister or any authorised officer — (a) print, publish, manufacture, sell, offer for sale or exhibit for sale; (b) cause to be printed, published, manufactured, sold, offered for sale or exhibited for sale; (c) send, distribute or deliver to, or serve on, any other person; or (d) cause to be sent, distributed or delivered to, or served on, any other person, any writing, material or object in or on which appears the Arms or any token, insignia, emblem or other thing that so nearly resembles the Arms as to be capable of being mistaken for the Arms." Rule 3(2) states: "[N]o person shall, without the prior written permission of the Minister or any authorised officer, use or apply the Arms on any writing, material or object." That was why the coat of arms was replaced with Image:Singov top 02.gif in {{Politics of Singapore}}, as these regulations do not apply to use of that logo.

I'm not sure whether it is worth writing to the relevant Minister to ask for permission for use of the state crest in Wikipedia articles. The main question is whether Wikipedia articles need to comply with Singapore law, or whether Wikipedia policy is that compliance with US law is sufficient (this seems to be the case for fair use of images, for instance). Can anyone shed light on this matter? If not, is there an administrator we can ask about this?

I've notified Mailer diablo of this matter on his talk page. Cheers, Jacklee 18:36, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• I based it off the guidelines of the official site. Didn't know their terms is more complicated than what the site offered. I note that the Supreme Court is also using the COA as their logo. At least there is a point of contact to actually ask. - Best regards, Mailer Diablo 18:41, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
  • I would also note that traditionally and from past experience it is almost impossible to get permission from local agencies, so don't have high expectations if you go ahead. - Mailer Diablo 18:49, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Mailer diablo. Well, the website that you refer to states: "The use of the state crest for advertisements or any other commercial purpose is prohibited by law. Only government bodies can display the state crest within their premises. Approval must be sought for any other use of the state crest." There's no problem with the Supreme Court making use of the crest on its website, because the Court is an organ of state. I note that the website also states:

For enquiries on use of the state crest, please contact:

Ms Joyce Lee
Assistant Manager (Heritage Programmes)
National Heritage Board
Singapore
Email: joyce_lee@nhb.gov.sg
Tel: 63324494
Fax: 63323525

Ms Elizabeth Njo
Assistant Manager (Psychological Defence)
National Heritage Board
Singapore
Email: elizabeth_njo@nhb.gov.sg
Tel: 63324495
Fax: 63323525

Perhaps it might be worth contacting one of these persons to ask for permission for use of the national coat of arms in Wikipedia articles. An argument might be made out that this promotes Singapore's heritage and supports psychological defence. Anyway, if we don't try we will never know. But I agree that it's often difficult to get a response from government agencies on matters like this. Perhaps they are deemed to be too inconsequential to merit a response. For instance, I wrote to the National Museum of Singapore for permission to use a photograph of the Singapore Stone published in one of their books, but never received a reply. (The photograph is currently being used in the article under a detailed fair-use rationale, which I hope is sufficient.) What do other SGpedians think? Cheers, Jacklee 18:56, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• No reply, that's...odd? Because in the past government agencies actually *came* to us to strongly object the use of their logos and stuff. - Mailer Diablo 19:05, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh, really, what happened then? And if that happened, why do you think it's a good idea to use the national coat of arms now? Cheers, Jacklee 19:10, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• Almost every other country's infoboxes adopt it. Forgot that our country is 'Unique'. - Mailer Diablo 19:13, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

That could be because the rules concerning the use of coats of arms of other countries are less restrictive. Or that the rules are being ignored. Perhaps we should go back to using a photograph of Parliament House. I remember that that was used at one stage. Cheers, Jacklee 22:34, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

• Good point...Wonder why aren't we using that anymore? Free images (in terms of copyright) always take precedence over non-free images. - Mailer Diablo 01:57, 5 October 2007 (UTC) (Way Of Life)

Yes, I rather liked the photograph – better than the current logo, anyway. By the way, I put a photograph of the Supreme Court Building in the infobox in the "Lock v. Goh" article. Cheers, Jacklee 02:37, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I've restored the Parliament House image. - Mailer Diablo 14:25, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

New template: {{Singapore Constitution}}

After much difficulty, I've created a new template, {{Singapore Constitution}}, that inserts a citation to the latest reprint of the Template:Singapore Constitution. Do make use of it where appropriate, and if you are knowledgable about templates please feel free to improve the template as well. Cheers, Jacklee 19:17, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

MRT Accidents wiki-worthy?

I've found that many of the MRT station articles are littered with sections on minor accidents. Now, events like bomb scares (Yishun) or train collision (Clementi), those are definitely fine. But to include everything from suicides to slipping on the escalator... not to be insensitive to suicides, but those are minor issues, no matter how you look at it. OK, these may be featured on the news, but it's really hardly worth a mention here. A review of the all the (above ground) station pages should be required to filter these needless information, and to keep what we really need.

If you want a list of accidents, maybe collect them on a single page, for example, List of accidents on the Singapore MRT, although I can't guarantee it won't get VfD. Like I said, most of it should not even be on Wikipedia. 리지강.wa.au (의논하다|기여) 16:36, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Use of s-line for MRT stations

Currently, there is a template for station line succession boxes: Template:S-line. Pages for a large number of train and subway systems all over the world have adapted this system. I was wondering if anyone is interested in adapting this for the Singapore MRT as well. If no one is willing to give it a go, then I'll be glad to convert them some time in the future. I understand that the current pages already use a localised template, but maybe for the sake of conserving bandwidth, a common template can be used with the rest of Wikipedia. 리지강.wa.au (의논하다|기여) 16:49, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

• You mean, standardization? I would appreciate a sample so I can try and convert some, the syntax looks quite a bit to me. =P - Mailer Diablo 15:09, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
  • Yes standardization, couldn't think of the actual word. Anyway, I've created some examples to cover all the MRT lines here. If all goes well, I think we can implement this throughout all the stations.리지강.wa.au (의논하다|기여) 15:19, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Between Silat and Pencak Silat

Silat article, which is under this project, is in the subject of ongoing heavy writing between two views. One insists to separate the two articles while others are trying to combine the two. A consensus is needed whether to merge or to separate these two articles and to avoid any unilateral acts in the future. Your comments are welcomed here: Talk:Silat#Merge_between_Silat_and_Pencak_Silat. — Indon (reply) — 08:13, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Flag of Singapore, again

Would anyone be so kind to try and find me a construction sheet for the flag? Examples of what I am looking for are [2] or [3]. I do not need the colors, since I have found a source already for them (Pantone 032 for Red, Pantone Safe for White). User:Zscout370 ^{(Return Fire)} 06:37, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Does this help? http://flagspot.net/flags/sg.html. — Cheers, JackLee ^–talk– 23:24, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Singapore Manual of Style?

I think we are in a kinda interesting position in that our "notice board" is also working as a "wikiproject". What has been missing, and often sorely needed, is some kind of a "manual of style" or "naming convention" for Singapore-related articles. Any thoughts if this is neccesary, and how we may proceed with this?--Huaiwei 01:56, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Do we really need one? WikiProject Iceland has a (proposed) Manual of Style for Iceland-related articles because of unusual letters in their alphabet and the fact that it is conventional to sort people according to their given names rather than their surnames: see "Wikipedia:Manual of Style (Iceland-related articles)". Are there aspects of Singapore-related articles that require special treatment that are not covered by the general Wikipedia:Manual of Style? Could you give some examples? — Cheers, JackLee ^{–talk • contribs • count–} 15:11, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Sections 377 and 377A of the Penal Code (Singapore): Renaming of article

The Penal Code (Amendment) Act 2007 has been passed by Parliament. The current title of the article "Sections 377 and 377A of the Penal Code (Singapore)" is therefore out of date, and there is now a more urgent need to decide what should be done about the article. There is currently a discussion at its talk page on whether the article should be expanded in scope to cover all sexual offences in Singapore and renamed as "Sexual offences in Singapore", or merged with "LGBT rights in Singapore". Do add any comments that you have on the issue. If there are no further comments on the matter in a fortnight or so, I may go ahead and be bold (depending on how busy I am). — Cheers, JackLee ^{–talk • contribs • count–} 15:48, 30 October 2007 (UTC)